Not a knee jerk reaction

[sjb12681]

This is a continuation of last year (really back to the SEA playoff loss)


At first it was "ST is our focus, we WILL fix this"

Then it was "Jordy is missing"

Then it was "Mike needs to take back playcalls"

Then it was [insert your choice]

I said this months ago. Losing the way we did to SEA does something to a team. It changes mindsets, it leaves permanent scars that dictate how games are called, plays are ran. It can make you too cautious, and over think what you are doing.

I said it then, when we lost, that this team would be different moving forward. It is something that can take YEARS to recover from. Looking at the way we are coaching, how our QB is playing, and how we have COMPLETELY changed our offensive mindset over the last season+ 2 games, I am beginning to think this is something we will see for at least the rest of this year.

There are no excuses on this type of game. There are no excuses for barely winning in Jax, to watch JAX get demolished today. There is no reason we should worry about a 4th and anything from anywhere on the field every drive.

This team has been known as a prolific offense, with a "master playcaller" in MM, and a QB who is a first ballot HOFer.

We saw this with Mike Sherman and BF when 4th and 24 happened. I think we are watching it right now, again.

This is not the same team we went into the SEA game with. It was hidden last year behind missing Jordy and McCarthy giving up play-calling, but nonetheless, it is not the same team.

We are no longer prolific on offense. We no longer have a master calling plays. We no longer have a surgeon throwing the ball.

Its not a knee jerk reaction, it is just on the heels of yet another game where we over-promised and under-preformed.

 

[greeners29]

Very thoughtful response to tonight. I would add that we dont seem to learn lessons.

We are not making any holes for 27 or 44 to run into. Arod is not looking like a MVP and has not on the whole (apart from a couple of hailmarys since game 5 last year), he is missing passes that he should be making.

Capers seems incapable of seeing and learning from trends, the amount of 3rd and longs we get hit with a post route etc. We have lost five 4th down conversions this season.

If Peterson's injury is not serious I can see the Vikings winning the North this year again (even with their harder schedule). I was at Jax last week and we got lucky with a few calls by the umpires and could and should have been hot with at least three pass interference penalties that were not given. We could easily be 0-2 right now.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

I hate to say it, and it's not that I think we should move on yet, at least I'm not ready to. But the buck stops with Aaron Rodgers. I mean, let's face it, he has been majorly indecisive where he would pull the trigger in the past, and for the better part of last year and heading into this year, he's on his scramble around and if all else fails chuck it deep routine. Favre did this in his mid-30s, Kurt Warner hit a slump in that period, Brees hasn't been the same old QB he was in the 2009-2011 era, and it looks like Rodgers has hit his. Last year I think we all just figured the Nelson and McCarthy things had messed things up a bit, but it's becoming clear that's not the case. This is on Aaron and he has to own it

 

[RyleesPop]

I am with you in the respect that the playcalling was completely suspect tonight. There were a number of times in critical short yardage downs we passed the ball and came away with nothing. A-Rodg looked awful tonight, Jordy is not on the same page with him and Eddy still looks a step slow hitting the hole. That all being sad Minnesota has probably one of the top 3-5 team defenses in the league, and they had emotion on their side opening up a new ball park and playing on Sunday night.

 

[C-Lee]

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[G0P4ckG0]

If the season continues to be sup-bar like we have witnessed in the first 2 games, it will be time to give serious consideration to trading Rodgers. He has looked "off" for 2 years now and with Callahan and Hundley looking to be future starters in the NFL, I think the return on our investment will be worth the trade.

 

[greeners29]

If the season continues to be sup-bar like we have witnessed in the first 2 games, it will be time to give serious consideration to trading Rodgers. He has looked "off" for 2 years now and with Callahan and Hundley looking to be future starters in the NFL, I think the return on our investment will be worth the trade.

I said similar earlier today. He has not looked like an MVP in nearly a year apart form a couple of hailmarys. It might be the way to go come April.

 

[sjb12681]

Its worse than that, but not easily identified. There are clues in the game though.

How many mismanagement of the playclock situations have happened in the last 20 games?

Last week we did the almost unspeakable of calling a timeout after a timeout for christ sake. Adding insult, Im pretty sure when we did it, we no longer had any time outs.

We are making mental mistakes, we are overthinking our plays, and we are taking 1+1=2 type plays and trying to "fake, double fake, put in players that will make the D think 'they will never run the play they are lined up for' then reverse double jedi mind trick" plays. Or as most people call them "head scratcher".

I feel this whole team has been a head scratcher for a year.

Seeing MM with that "WTF, this isnt what I called" look on his face just ****** me off even more. Maybe if we got lower pad levels, all this nonsense would work.

 

[PackerFanLV]

This team has no Identity. Every team is starting to play us the same and they are having success. Press our receivers and bottle aaron in. We have no structure its like a miracle for the O to get a first down now every pass is contested every run now is darn near with a TE in the back field instead of a FB. We are putting randall cobb at RB like why?? I think MM is so confused hes making this game of football way harder then it needs to be.

 

[sjb12681]

If the season continues to be sup-bar like we have witnessed in the first 2 games, it will be time to give serious consideration to trading Rodgers. He has looked "off" for 2 years now and with Callahan and Hundley looking to be future starters in the NFL, I think the return on our investment will be worth the trade.

Disagree, MM will be gone before AR is. AR is a part of the problem, but he isnt the main part. AR may get moved one day, but it isnt time in the foreseeable future.

 

[sjb12681]

I think MM is so confused hes making this game of football way harder then it needs to be.

This is exactly what I have been saying for a very long time. MM went into SEA with a VERY good gameplan, and 23 out of 23 things happened, needed to happen, and SEA won. It SHOOK this team and coaching staff, and they have had a case of the shanks ever since.

We have thrown out "what works" and gone with "THIS WORKED".

We dont throw slants, we hard count. We dont run i formation gut slams plays, we pistol offset inside pitch. We dont run combination routes against basic zone/ man sets, we run iso routes with bad timing.

We have no identity, and we are scared to see what it is now if we had one. We are like we play. We are scrambling for "what works right now in this situation". We no longer dictate a game.

We react to the other teams game.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

This team has no Identity. Every team is starting to play us the same and they are having success. Press our receivers and bottle aaron in. We have no structure its like a miracle for the O to get a first down now every pass is contested every run now is darn near with a TE in the back field instead of a FB. We are putting randall cobb at RB like why?? I think MM is so confused hes making this game of football way harder then it needs to be.

I will agree I've never liked using wide receivers as RBs. Also, I'm starting to worry more about what we were hearing last year about what the media was calling a growing rift between Rodgers and McCarthy. They both downplayed it, but it's looking like there could be some real legitimacy to it. But I'm just really thinking right now that buck is stopping with Aaron. More so because I really don't buy this stuff anymore about receivers not getting open because I saw plenty of plays out there that they were. Rodgers has just been making some terrible reads and holding onto the ball too long lately, a problem he seemed to have developed after that Denver game last year. He needs to snap out of this or this offense is going to be painful to watch all year.

 

[G0P4ckG0]

AR may get moved one day, but it isnt time in the foreseeable future.

Why not? We clearly are not capable of winning a Super Bowl with him. He has looked average for a while and our current backups could play just as well as him with the current team. By trading him we could open up tons of cap space and draft a few players in the high rounds to improve other areas of need. I think McCarthy is also a big part of the problem and have been calling for him to be fired for the past 4 seasons.

 

[thisisnate]

Talking about trading Rodgers is completely insane right now.

 

[sjb12681]

Why not? We clearly are not capable of winning a Super Bowl with him. He has looked average for a while and our current backups could play just as well as him with the current team. By trading him we could open up tons of cap space and draft a few players in the high rounds to improve other areas of need. I think McCarthy is also a big part of the problem and have been calling for him to be fired for the past 4 seasons.

Because while I blame him for the plays inside the live action, I cant blame him for the route tree being taught, the players in the game, and the poor iso plays being called. He is certainly a large part of whats not clicking. I just do not thing its bc of skill decline or decision making. He is playing safe for sure,but thats inside of the bad plays being called to him in the huddle (IMO)

 

[G0P4ckG0]

Talking about trading Rodgers is completely insane right now.

Care to elaborate on how it would be insane?

 

[G0P4ckG0]

Because while I blame him for the plays inside the live action, I cant blame him for the route tree being taught, the players in the game, and the poor iso plays being called. He is certainly a large part of whats not clicking. I just do not thing its bc of skill decline or decision making. He is playing safe for sure,but thats inside of the bad plays being called to him in the huddle (IMO)

That's a major part of my point. If there is little he can do even if he is in his prime, then why not get a large return on his investment while we can?

 

[armand34]

I agree with a lot of the fair criticism in this thread. The Packers seem to be living off the reputation they had back in the 2010-2014 era. We haven't been good on offense in a while now.

I'm just tired of seeing Rodgers try to build something out of nothing on almost EVERY play. How does he have a solid 1.5 seconds inside that pocket and not find the open guy???

Maybe he needs to check his EGO at the door and get back to what drove him to be the top QB in this league.

 

[Carl]

Because while I blame him for the plays inside the live action, I cant blame him for the route tree being taught, the players in the game, and the poor iso plays being called. He is certainly a large part of whats not clicking. I just do not thing its bc of skill decline or decision making. He is playing safe for sure,but thats inside of the bad plays being called to him in the huddle (IMO)

Not going to say the play calling was good because to be honest I can't tell.

What play calls made a drive fail to it's bad though?

It's pretty easy to find ones that didn't work due to player mistakes: Cook running back, Buluga missing a block for a fumble, Rodgers throwing a bad pick, Rodgers missing on open Cobb on 3rd down.

 

[Carl]

Care to elaborate on how it would be insane?

So insane nobody should waste time to elaborate.

 

[Shawnsta3]

>Not a knee-jerk reaction.
Then goes on to explain why it is

>4th and 24
Lol

>This is not the same team we went into SEA game with
Yes it is, of course they lost Sitton, Kuhn etc. and added some guys in Cooks, Montgomery, Davis, etc. but overall this is almost the same exact roster.

Ultimately, let's not overreact to a week 2 loss. This offense has waited to truly click until the stretch run before and coming off 4 straight road games getting a stretch at home will help. Even as far as home field goes teams like Seattle and Carolina have yet to find a true rhythm as well.

 

[G0P4ckG0]

So insane nobody should waste time to elaborate.

Is that a homer response, or is it a response from someone who is taking a business-minded approach to potentially improving a team?

These same discussions were around during the Favre years. Indy fans also had these discussions while Manning was there and New England fans have been having these discussions about Brady for a few years. I will admit it would suck to have Rodgers not be a part of this team like was the case when Favre left, but we have to analyze the pros and cons of the potential outcome. If Rodgers stays and the rest of the team stays intact, we will continue seeing an early playoff exit until he retires. If he leaves, worst case scenario is we go without a Super Bowl win...which is the same as if Rodgers stays. Best case scenario is we improve the team and create a different culture that gives the team a CHANCE to win a Super Bowl. I'll take the latter.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Talking about trading Rodgers is completely insane right now.

Agreed, and I'm not sugarcoating what Rodgers is doing. He does deserve to catch flack right now, he's not right and ... well to call a spade a spade, he's missed big throws he'd normally make in the past and some of his passes have just floated and had no zip on them either. These struggles fall on him as much as anyone.

But count me in the crowd that says trading him is not what to do right now. He's hit a bad part of his career. Brett Favre was really bad for a few years there too but we stuck with him and his last year almost got back to the Superbowl one more time. Don't see why not go give Rodgers that same chance. The Rams sent Kurt Warner off packing and that alone is why their team has sucked ever since. We can't fall for that same trap here.

 

[Carl]

Is that a homer response, or is it a response from someone who is taking a business-minded approach to potentially improving a team?

These same discussions were around during the Favre years. Indy fans also had these discussions while Manning was there and New England fans have been having these discussions about Brady for a few years. I will admit it would suck to have Rodgers not be a part of this team like was the case when Favre left, but we have to analyze the pros and cons of the potential outcome. If Rodgers stays and the rest of the team stays intact, we will continue seeing an early playoff exit until he retires. If he leaves, worst case scenario is we go without a Super Bowl win...which is the same as if Rodgers stays. Best case scenario is we improve the team and create a different culture that gives the team a CHANCE to win a Super Bowl. I'll take the latter.

What sane NE fans have been discussing trading Brady?

Also, let me get his straight. Did you just say right now, with Rodgers, they have 0% to win a Super Bowl, but without him, theyd have a chance?

 

[Packer Brother]

Should the Packers be 110 percent against the idea of trading A.R.? No. Will the Packers have one discussion about possibly trading Rodgers? No . The Packers are not only a team, yet a business too. No way they risk losing fans or business by trading their top star.

It's time Mark Murphy starts becoming more involved. Tired of TT patching holes up with rookies or undrafted free agents. Someone needs to step up. Five playoff failures in a row. (. Including two home playoff losses, blowout @SF, Seattle Meltdown).