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New way of thinking

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by net, Sep 21, 2005.

  1. net

    net Cheesehead

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    A few of the usual suspects are banging the "fire Sherman" drum again....again....again...am I repeating myself?

    Perhaps your thinking is out of date.

    The new "top dog" is a guy named Ted Thompson. The personnel decisions that led to this year's squad were ultimately Ted Thompson's.

    I haven't seen a nasty word thrown Thompson's way about the ROSTER.

    I'm not about to do it either.

    But folks, the players are now mostly Thompson's call, not Sherman's.

    Last year I realized that the Packers personnel is simply not up to par. Keep in mind Sherman has produced teams with 12 wins, so he has proven that his PHILOSOPHY is sound.

    What is missing is better talent.

    Here's a case in point, one of which I'm as guilty as many of you: Aaron Kampman. The Morons of the Mississippi(Vikinks) wanted him to hurt Green Bay, in part, and bolster their line. Even Ted fouled this one up. This guy should have been let go. He's a hustler, but what the line needs is pass rusher. Kampman simply has disappeared.

    They simply have mediocre or very young talent. Compare Grady(fat old slow and always hurt) to Shaun Rogers(young, athletic, strong) to see what has happened.

    Here's another shocker: Brett has to remember he's 36 years old. He can still sling the hash, but his 2-1 touchdown to interception ratio isn't measuring up.

    The McKenzie thing was more than a contract. I think McKenzie saw the handwriting on the wall regarding the team and wanted to bail(with a new contract) somewhere else.

    I could go on.

    Lets put Jim Bates in as head coach after the Bucs game. Do you think that the team will suddenly rebound? Maybe a little, not much.

    It's time to realize that Ted Thompson changed direction to build to the future, and Sherman really has evolved into a relatively small part of that change.

    So some of you might get your wish and Sherman will go, but it won't change the nature of the team, at least not this year. Unless you can pull a personnel rabbit out of your hat, the Packers aren't going to be very good this year.

    Where's the Miller Lite?
     
  2. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    TT selected 11-14 of the players on the roster. Do you think quality players grow on trees? You can't cut someone without having someone to replace them with. Would you have rather he just cut all the slackass's had brough in ppl off the street? TT I believe doesn't want to make any decisions too fast before knowing thoroughly what he has before doing so.
    You wanna push any blame towards TT we have to wait a year atleast. The guy has had the horns for seven? months. This is not HIS roster. This is Sherman's hand picked roster with a few pickups from the Wolf era.

    The stench on Sherman's roster has been dually noted and earned. He made poor decisions hence why he's no longer the GM. If TT fails to improve the team with quality players he too will be blasted, I assure you. Its the nature of the beast.

    I wanna like Sherman because I think he's a classy guy. But I don't think he's getting the job done as a coach. He says the right things yet we're not seeing them on the field. Also we have to consider this. The Packers have changed their defense for a third consective year. I know that sounds like an excuse. However it MUST take its toll on players.

    Stability is something most desire.


    Overall. I still love my Packers and will always root for them no matter what record they may earn. I admit I've been spoiled with a most dominant team for the last 12 or so years and I for one am not used to this 0 - 2 crap!! I'm only 25 and didn't really get into the Packers until the Majik-Sharpe TD win over the Bears (Instant Replay) game. We had a few bad years then struck gold with Wolf/Holmgren/Brett/Reggie/etc.
     
  3. Chamuko

    Chamuko Cheesehead

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    Well then lets fire TT,,,, He got a SB ready team with only first quality players, all coming from Shemy´´s Drafts days, he got a team with a lot of money to be spent on the salary cap,,, and then this evil underachiver SIGNED CLETIDUS TO A BIG CONTRACT, THEN HE MISSHANDLED KGB´S SITUATION AND ENDED UP IN A RACE VS THE EAGLES TO SIGN HIM AND SPENT A LOT OF $$$ NOT TO LOOSE HIM, THEN HE VICIOUSLY LET SHARPER GO, THEN HE FIRED DONNATEL AS SCAPEGOAT BECAUSE HE, TT, HASNT GOT THE BALLS TO GO FOR A 4 & INCHES, AND HIRED SLOWIK, ETC, ETC..

    I have came to a situation in which the Packers situation is clearly´s TT´s fault, maybe he is an undercover Viqueen working to destroy us and damaging the good name an perfect reputation of our beloved team and our excelent coach...

    Now I can go to sleep in peace at night !!!

    Give me a break !!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  4. Chamuko

    Chamuko Cheesehead

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    By the way I would LOVE to see Master Bates instead of Sherman as of today, and on any given sunday, and I have been trying to find an excuse to stay on Shermans side, but after this last game I have been totally unnable to find one !!!!

    Sherman is one person that works as HC and the Packers are an institution, the MOST important Football team in History, so being different things I can be against Sherman bassed on how he is coaching the team and I can still love my Packers so GO SHERMAN, but GO somewhere else.

    and

    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPACKERSGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
     
  5. PackMan

    PackMan Cheesehead

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    Can someone put up a list of coach's that are available now or after the season and would be beter then coach Sherman? And why would they be better. I'm sorry but if the players would be in the position they are coached to be in we wouldn't be 0-2. The only thing that realy upsets me is the penalties and they are a sign of coaching.
     
  6. net

    net Cheesehead

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    It's utterly amazing to me how each of you think in one dimension:

    FIRE EVERYBODY! It's EVERYBODY'S FAULT!

    --
    Sherman did what he thought was best. Quite frankly, your criticism of him with his record is stunning, and laughable. Maybe you'd like the Bears record over the past 15 years? Sherman wanted veterans. They turned out to be dogs. Keep in mind the endless chanting for MORE VETERAN FREE AGENTS THIS OFFSEASON! Go ask the Vikings.

    TT believes in draft picks. Young players take time to develop, but pay off the most. An occasional affordable free agent works.

    Neither person is AT FAULT. Repeat: Neither person is at fault. Sherman's way didn't work, they tried another. Sherman has yet to prove to me he CAN'T COACH. So you fire the coach(is this baseball?) even though he has a winning record because the players suck. Smart. Logical.
    --
    This is a new team, and it's time to simply look at it as a losing year caused by aging vets who can't cut it and rookies who weren't ready.

    NO ONE IS AT FAULT. That is how the NFL works.
     
  7. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

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    I'm not 100% sure but I think you just contradicted your self from your initial post that started this thread.

    I'm not understanding much of this post except I do know when a team fails there is fault and it has to be found and remedied THAT is how the NFL works. You don't start losing games and go 'oh well shucky darn thats how the nfl works'. You try harder you dig deep you find the source of the problems and do what you have to in order to win. Winning is what it is all about, not rolling over saying 'thats how the nfl works'
     
  8. SuperRat

    SuperRat Cheesehead

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    I take issue with the knock on Kampman. Let us look at the stats. Kampman - 8 tackles 6 solo. KGB - 9 tackles 5 solo. Kampman 1 sack. KGB .5 sacks. Kampman 1.5 Tackles for loss. KGB .5 tackle for loss. How the hell can you say Kampman has dissapeared withought mentioning KGB?
     
  9. LambeauLeaper

    LambeauLeaper Cheesehead

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    Every time I read about TT and his methods, something itches that I can't seem to scratch. I know what I want to say, but it's hard to fully explain it. There's something that bothers me about TT's obsession with the draft. I fully agree that the draft is where you make your team. But, you have to absolutely mix in some key free agents. It's too early to write the book on TT, he needs a couple of offseasons to get an accurate read on his methods, but I'm really hoping he doesn't abandon free agency altogether (and I don't mean the Arturo Freemans and Earl Littles of the world). It seems like the 1 or 2 blockbuster signings are what put teams over the hump. Case in point, Reggie White. In the mid 90s we were getting to the playoffs regularly only to lose in Dallas every year. Then we signed Reggie and a few other key contributors and the rest is history. New England has made key FA signings every year (ie. Rodney Harrison, Corey Dillon, etc.) Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Packers are close to getting "over the hump", but teams do not thrive on the draft alone.

    I'm thinking TT saw that 1 or 2 big name FA's weren't going to be enough to change this years team (not to mention the salary cap situation) and has been looking at this as a rebuilding project since he got here. I wouldn't be suprised to see another year or two of the same philosophy - staying out of the big name FA market and focusing on draft picks.

    People wonder what's wrong with this team this year. It's easy to point the finger at coaching, but the reality is the woeful lack of talent and pure studs. We've really bombed in the last several drafts with our #1 picks (besides Javon, of course). Go even further and look at our picks from the top 3 rounds every year..

    2004
    1 - Ahmad Carroll
    3 - Joey Thomas
    3 - Donnell Washington
    3 - B.J. Sander

    2003
    1 - Nick Barnett
    3 - Kenny Peterson
    5 - James Lee

    2002
    1 - Javon Walker
    3 - Marques Anderson

    2001
    1 - Jamal Reynolds
    2 - Robert Ferguson
    3 - Bhawoh Jue
    3 - Torrance Marshall


    That's 13 players with only 1 being considered "blue" (top players at their position). The rest either aren't even on the team anymore, or haven't done a whole lot in their careers thusfar. Then you look at the number of busts we've had in the FA market - quite a few "misses" and virtually no "hits". Now you look at the FA's we've had to let go because of the poor decisions on FA's - the overall situation is a freakin' train wreck.

    Is it Sherman's fault? Yes. You have to do your homework regarding the draft AND free agents. History points to that not being the case with Sherman - you just can't miss on that many players if you've done your homework. Is it too late to fix it? For this year, and probably the next couple years, I think it is. TT has his work cut out for him, IMO, and it's not going to be an overnight fix. I think a couple of strong drafts, some crafty FA signings, maybe a trade or two and we can be a tough team again. This is what brings me back to my original point - TT seems to be extremely gunshy when it comes to FA's. That may be somewhat warranted, but if he abandons it altogether we're screwed. Like he said earlier in the year, "free agency is a minefield", but without it you're left with a team full of rookies and 2-3 year players with no one to steer the ship.
     
  10. digsthepack

    digsthepack Cheesehead

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    I do not think you can bring in that kind of FA player until the team's foundation is established and requiring the one or two top FAs to really elevate the team. Right now it seems to me TT is building the foundation. I mean, bring in a top FA right now and there is a very good chance his career will be over or his contract expired before all the other pieces are in place.
     
  11. P@ck66

    P@ck66 Banned Banned

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    net said,

    "But folks, the players are now mostly Thompson's call, not Sherman's.

    Last year I realized that the Packers personnel is simply not up to par. Keep in mind Sherman has produced teams with 12 wins, so he has proven that his PHILOSOPHY is sound.
    What is missing is better talent."


    Net..

    the only thing that it proves is that Favre had just "barely" enough talent around him to bail Sherman's lame *** out...year in and year out.... And now Brett doesn't even have that!

    and what it also proves is that you must have a giant MANCRUSH on Mike Sherman ....because that is the only thing that explains your slavish devotion to this man in face of all evidence to the contrary....!

    You are jumping through hoops to rationalize Sherman's screw ups....

    Brett's interception ratio? Patently unfair..when Sherossley's friggin' game plan is soooo predictable and the Packer's receivers have not exactly been getting open or lighting it up...it's a little much to put all on Brett's shoulders....

    The McKenzie thing?
    He realized what a boob Sherman was by promoting his "crony" Slowit to DC..he had to bail...that's the writing he saw on the wall....

    You've basically admitted that Sherman sucked at GM....

    Would you care to admit that he sucks as a Head Coach too?...

    It's gonna get awfully lonely on that island you're pontificating from...
     
  12. musccy

    musccy Cheesehead

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    Brett's int:attempt ratio over the years...

    .045 <--- '92
    .024
    .024
    .0228
    .024 <---sb win
    .0312 <---sb loss
    .0387
    .029
    .029
    .029
    .029
    .044
    .031 <---last year.

    It seems relatively consistent over the years, in spite of drastic changes in the rosters, coaching staff, and management. But I guess it's all Sherman and Rossely's fault.

    Is it possible that YOU have a little mancrush on Brett?
     
  13. P@ck66

    P@ck66 Banned Banned

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    Musscy,

    What you are saying then is that Brett has been pretty good over the years and was able to win with Holmgren, yet Sherman has not even been able to bring them to an NFC Championship game, or even win at home at Lambeau field, isn't it?
     
  14. musccy

    musccy Cheesehead

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    actually, no I'm pointing out that Brett's interception ratio is fairly consistent in spite of the coordinator or coach in charge.

    And sure, lets bring back our good 'ole buddy Holmgren. Maybe he can let a grant a few more token TDs to Terrell Davis, or your rb of choice in the Super Bowl, contributing to one of the larger upsets in SB history! And it sure seems like he did a great job as GM, and has continued doing an extraordinary job as HC out west.
     
  15. TOPackerFan

    TOPackerFan Cheesehead

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    Holmgren did have the benefit of a #1 defense and perhaps the greatest defensive player of the last generation.
     

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