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Kaepernick & the Zone Read Option

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by FrankRizzo, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    I was just watching Turning Point on NBC Sports, and that zone run stuff scares me.
    The Redskins, when RG3 was healthy, aren't the only ones who run it dangerously.
    So does Seattle with Marshawn Lynch and Russell Wilson, and Seattle with Kaepernick & Frank Al Gore.

    Gore himself has hurt us before. This year, he had 100+ on us, the only back other than Peterson to do that.

    Don't kid yourselves, this is an effective thing with the right talent, and Kaepernick and that OL have it.

    Also, Joe Webb & the Vikings are a A or AA team compared to a Major League Team. It's no comparison. Kaepernick is a better runner, smarter, was not rusty like Webb, and here's the key: they also have the fastest TE in the league who has killed us many times before, as well as Randy Moss, another guy who seems to score against us a lot.
    And Crabtree, who has caught fire this year, and scores against us too.

    There will be times when our eyes think Gore has it, and he doesn't.... and some times where the Packers go at Kaepernick, but Gore has it.

    What I want Capers, Greene, Trgy to do is to instruct the DL, LB, CBs to CRUSH THE HEAD of Kaepernick anytime he pitches the ball to the RB.
    He's not a passer, you can clobber the s*** out of these guys when they are runners.

    And when he keeps it, I want Bishop (oh wait, he's out), Perry... Worthy.... ok, Neal, Daniels, Jones, Hawk to crush Gore even when he doesn't have it.

    I Want these guys hearing, and feeling, footsteps any time they run that trick s***. Make them jittery. And sore.

    They go after Rodgers every throw, and they will hit him after he's thrown it. That's what we do, and they go after our guy.

    We have to do the same thing to their zone option run hocus pocus.
    Create a fumble.
    Or two.

    If we can out-physical them, it will be a blowout city, like we did to them in the 90's except for the game the refs stole from us when Jerry Rice fumbled. And then TO made his best catch ever.

    Mindset is a big part of it.
    We need to crush some heads Saturday night instead of us always getting hurt.
    Still, that ZoneReadOption is tough and Kaepernick is fast and strong! Damn him.
     
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  2. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Little extreme?
     
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  3. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    Channeling his inner Greg Williams? Frank's just been cranky ever since Worthy went down. Have to agree some, If they run the option, gotta make them pay. Negative behavioral reinforcement is an effective tool.
     
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  4. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    Yes, I mean hit him exactly how all teams hit Rodgers when he throws the ball, before he throws it, or after he throws the ball.
    But when the QB is a runner, he's less protected.
    We need to make them pay for that. That's part of strategy, within the rules.

    They have big guys, they have a safety who hunts ACL's... they're physical.
    No reason we can't be too, within the rules.
     
  5. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    I've been cranky since August 9th when my man Bishop went down with a fluke injury I rarely have ever seen.
    And I still am cranky that we lost a great player and man in Nick Collins when he was as clean as they get.
     
  6. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    The negative reinforcement is hitting Kaepernick when he runs. Think of it as spanking a naughty child, he'll get the idea when he's sore enough.
     
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  7. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    Yep yep.... it's the same as nailing a WR going across the middle. They will hear footsteps the next times... whether the zebra throws a flag or not.
    Alligator arms grow.

    I'd like to dress Chuck Cecil for this game, just for an early play when they throw to a guy across the middle.
     
  8. CandlestickBum

    CandlestickBum Cheesehead

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    Just my two cents: if you go after Kaepernick directly with a blitz he will burn you passing out of the pocket or running around the blitzers.

    His biggest problems are his inexperience, poor game management skills, and poor passing skills out of the pocket.

    The teams that have been effective against Kaepernick have contained the RBs to three yards or less per carry to force throws and then forced Kapernick out of the pocket, where he is a poor passer.

    Kaepernick has basically three strengths: As QBs go, he is huge (6'5", probably at least 240-250 pounds now), he is incredibly fast, and he was drafted as a pitcher by the Chicago cubs, so he can throw the rock as hard and accurately as anybody. He may be the most athletically talented QB in the game.

    But as far as other skills, he has not proven that he has anything special at this early point in his career. Get ahead and force him to pass on every play and his inability to effectively manage the game clock and force passes shows. He is not a QB like Rodgers or Brady who, with a lot of luck on his side, can force his way back from a 20 point deficit.

    But try to send blitzers against him to smack him around in the back field and he will burn you. He is not accurate like Alex Smith was this year, but he has a hell of a strong arm and some of the fastest feet in the business.
     
  9. Wood Chipper

    Wood Chipper Fantasy Football Guru

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    [​IMG]
     
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  10. ExpatPacker

    ExpatPacker Cheesehead

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    CandlestickBum I think you have it pretty much on the money here. Kaepernick is very dynamic but his basic poise in the pocket is his weakness. If the Packers can come out smoking and jump to a lead, that's their best chance to win the game since it will force Kaepernick into a game-plan he is not used to nor is he good at.

    The Packer defense needs to do what they did against the Vikings, which is set the edge, stay at home...in week 17 they got burned for not doing that, and they learned from it. However I don't think that the Packers can avoid the blitz. They have to mask it and do it selectively.
     
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  11. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    I am not for taking out a QB, but even if Kap goes down, they have Alex smith who is better (IMO) and is a playoff veteran. I would rather have Kap in there than to face a disiplined QB that has "been there,done that". Play off pressure is a mofo indeed.
     
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  12. JBlood

    JBlood Cheesehead

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    The run-option has been a part of the college game for generations, and is interesting in the NFL. But, as RGIII and Vick have proven--it isn't interesting for long. As for size, Culpepper was 6'4" and 264; could run like a deer and lasted five years before destroying his knee. There's a reason running backs in the NFL last an average of 4 years--which is what the "read-option" QB actually becomes. Wilson, Griffin III, Kaepernick are fun to watch. But you won't get to watch them for too long unless their game changes. As for this game, I think the 9ers will score on the Packers. It will be up to the offense to keep up. And that will come down to the o line stopping a 4 man rush, 2 of whom are injured. I think they'll be up to it.
     
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  13. burt packerack

    burt packerack Cheesehead

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    I would be a lot more nervous with Alex Smith playing. Kaep is gonna be nervous despite what all of his kool-aid fans say. Any rookie QB is gonna be wide eyed playing us in the playoffs.
     
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  14. 13 Times Champs

    13 Times Champs Cheesehead

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    Exactly JBlood. You run that offense and it puts your QB at a far bigger risk for injury. What Jerry Glanville said the NFL stood for "Not For Long" is a truism in this case.
     
  15. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    He's not a rookie, even though maybe you only first heard about him this year.
    Everyone thought he'd be nervous in his first start, against a Bears defense that traditionally holds Rodgers down as well as anyone. And Kaepernick did great.
    Everyone thought he'd be nervous on Sunday night at New England in December, where NE had not lost a December home game in about 10 years. And he hit them with 4 touchdowns.

    Playoffs are different, but he's gonna be fine. He won't give us the game if that's what Packer fans are hoping.

    We have to outplay the team, have to get pressure in the backfield on Gore and him. Have to tackle well. This guy will break some tackles.

    He doesn't have to have a long career to beat us in one game here.... I don't care about his longevity. We just need to get some turnovers finally. We're due for a Pick-fest.
    Woodson, TrayMon, Shields, Hayward.... anyone up for a Pick-6 this week?
     
  16. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    C'mon Frank, that was a bears team that was into it's decline mode that we all loved......It was SF's defense that saved their bacon vs New England ( who was on the verge of a come back )

    I just don't have stock in the kid....yet. Playing less than 1/2 a season does not prove crap in the NFL.....we have plenty of film on the kid now and I beleive the capers game plan will show itself to be pretty decent. Plus, Mathews and the rest of the QB attack team has been pretty damn good lately. He will have a tough time making good throws.
     
  17. The Rivalry

    The Rivalry Cheesehead

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    Long,sustained, clock eating drives from our offense is going to be huge. Both in terms of keeping their O off the field and forcing them to play from behind when they are on the field. I want Kap to feel like he has to keep up with Rodgers and the GB offense. It's gonna be tough, especially if Rodgers holds the ball too long looking for the knockout rather than taking the slants, 5 yrd jerk routes in the middle of the field, and the dump offs to Harris that were so effective vs minnesota last week.
     
  18. Marvin49

    Marvin49 Cheesehead

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    Wow...gonna argue with a fellow Niner fan here. lol.

    In particular "But as far as other skills, he has not proven that he has anything special at this early point in his career."

    If you really believe that, you're NUTS.

    I'll agree he's had some game management issues that have improved every week, and I'll agree he is FAR better when the run game is going and he gets defined looks on play action, and I'll agree he isn't a Rodgers/Brady who can wing it 60 times a game and will a team back from behind (who is this early in a career), but saying his passing is poor out of the pocket is BS.

    He's actually BETTER in the pocket than outside the pocket. I wish I had the stats in front of me but a few weeks ago before the Seattle game I was looking at a stat that had his QB Rating 20-30 points HIGHER in the pocket than out.

    Yes, he's physically gifted with a big arm, speed, and size. The reason he'splaying so well tho is his ACCURACY down the field and the fact that he doesn't get nervous and he doesn't get rattled. Ever. The ppes here keep showing the bad pitch. What that doesn't show is that his next play was a 50 yard run followed by what should have been the game winning TD if Delanie Walker hadn't dropped it.

    What makes him impressive is his nerves. Don't believe me?

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130109/harbaugh-kaepernick/

    Want more about his nerves?

    http://www.sacbee.com/2012/11/25/5008704/49ers-kaepernick-had-it-in-his.html

    I just want to make 1 think absolutely clear to Packer fans tho. I'm NOT comparing him to Aaron. Aaron is the best QB in this league. Kaep has a ton of potential, but at this point its unrealized potential. I just don't want this to become a Kaep vs Rodgers debate when there really is no debate.
     
  19. Marvin49

    Marvin49 Cheesehead

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    Just a heads up....

    The 49ers DO run the Read-Option, but nowhere near as much as Washington and Seattle. Kaep ran it ALOT early on, but less of late.

    Also, Frank Gores numbers have kinda slipped in that run style. Dunno if its just a coincidense or if there is something to it, but he hasn't been quite as effective. LaMichael James tho ran it in college and has been effective in limited opportunities.
     
  20. CandlestickBum

    CandlestickBum Cheesehead

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    Yeah, that is what I wrote. His passer rating is low outside the pocket. Sorry if my language was less than clear. If Kaepernick can stay in the pocket on most passes, he is spectacular. If the defense can force him out, he looks like Smith his rookie year.

    Alex Smith had the problem with not being good at seeing open eligible-receivers and tending to pass to whomever the play was designed for. Kaepernick seems to have that problem x10. There have been a lot of times when Moss or Davis were wide open down the field and Kaepernick tried to force something into coverage to hit Crabtree or Walker, and that is really too bad, because Kaepernick is far more accurate than Smith at passes >20 yards.

    If he learns how to quickly figure out who his best target is on the fly, like Rodgers, Manning, or Brees can do, then he could become the best QB in the NFL. Only time will tell. . .

    The good thing is, GB has the type of defense Kaepernick has tended to measure up very well against. The bad news is, if we win this game, we might have to host Seattle in a week.
     
  21. Marvin49

    Marvin49 Cheesehead

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    Oh wow.

    LOL...I TOTALLY misread your post. ROTFLMAO!!

    Sorry about that. I think he is improving every week tho on progressing through his reads.

    Also...

    Found another one..

    http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/kaepernick-a-quick-nfl-study-9989fj7-186119641.html
     
  22. burt packerack

    burt packerack Cheesehead

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    i meant a rookie in the playoffs. not necessarilly a rookie...my bad.
     
  23. burt packerack

    burt packerack Cheesehead

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    But thanks for making me feel like an a$$hole.
     
  24. Marvin49

    Marvin49 Cheesehead

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  25. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    Off topic... but WTF is Ted Ginn doing there with that fumble?!?! That's terrible, especially with 3-minutes left in the game!!!
     

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