JJ Post Combine Mock 1.0

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I like it. As you suggested, a trade down and then selection Bush or Hockenson or someone like that would be ideal.
I feel very comfortable with Hock in that #20 overall neighborhood. Ideally I’d like to get either him or Fant but I’m more of an advocate of balancing our running game and protecting our $100M+investment. He’s a ferocious blocker and reminds me a bit of a young version of Gronk where he’s a dual threat. My guess is there will be someone else remaining at #12 that we deem one of the top 8-10 and look to Defense or OT.
If we can find a way to buy Aaron Rodgers 1 more second and 1 more O playmaker he will be back to his usual self of carving up defenses.
 
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GleefulGary

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People dont need "to think what I think" and I have been debated up and down and side to side about guys i like so I don't see whats the difference.

And I haven't made this whole offseason about drafting one player like I have in the past with maybe Sutton at times last year. I've left all of my Parris Campbell talk in that particular thread. I haven't been freaking out that people on here are leaving him out of there mocks for some time now.

I wasn't for the TJ Watt pick a couple of years ago but at least he had the measurables and numbers to back up the Packers selecting him there in the 1st.

This Hockenson thing is approaching uncharted waters for any team that drafts him real high based on his numbers. If we are not here to debate ideas then i am kind of losing track of what the forum was inteded for. I'm not getting caught up at all on a paticular poster being right or wrong about anything. In fact i've stayed out of an entire thread to steer clear of such disruption. Quite frankly I am actually pretty proud of myslef.

Hock wasn't in this mock you dinglefart.
 

Dantés

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I feel very comfortable with Hock in that #20 overall neighborhood. Ideally I’d like to get either him or Fant but I’m more of an advocate of balancing our running game and protecting our $100M+investment. He’s a ferocious blocker and reminds me a bit of a young version of Gronk where he’s a dual threat. My guess is there will be someone else remaining at #12 that we deem one of the top 8-10 and look to Defense or OT.
If we can find a way to buy Aaron Rodgers 1 more second and 1 more O playmaker he will be back to his usual self of carving up defenses.

The problem is the trade partner piece.

There is always a chance that some team likes someone and we are in the right range.

But the most likely driver of a trade, and the driver that drives the best prices, is a QB. I'm not seeing that scenario likely to unfold.
 
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The problem is the trade partner piece.

There is always a chance that some team likes someone and we are in the right range.

But the most likely driver of a trade, and the driver that drives the best prices, is a QB. I'm not seeing that scenario likely to unfold.
It all depends what team needs are and their positioning as the draft unfolds. Last year the Saints traded up for a non QB. Heck I’d trade up for Quinnen Williams if somehow he managed to get outside pick #5. I think he’s worth 12+30 Him and Mo and Clark would be a handful.
 

Dantés

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It all depends what team needs are and their positioning as the draft unfolds. Last year the Saints traded up for a non QB. Heck I’d trade up for Quinnen Williams if somehow he managed to get outside pick #5. I think he’s worth 12+30 Him and Mo and Clark would be a handful.

Right. So I'm not saying it can't happen. And it would be a great outcome. But I also think it's a real possibility that there is no partner for a deal.
 

Dantés

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For the last time? Man I wish this is the last time I had to read this.

Look, you dont make the rules on who can be drafted and when.

Everyone has the right to think what they want.

Gute is definitely is not Janis or Dante, so swaying their opinion has ZERO effect on what the Pack actually does.

Therefore it doesnt matter what the hell they think.

Ease up on this drivel. It has gotten really frickin old.

It's fine to post your opinions. But, nobody needs to see it 100 times. If we still hold our same opinions after you tell us something, maybe we understand you, we just happen to disagree. It happens you know.

Purpose of this forum is to discuss and learn, not to make everyone think like you.

Nobody needs to be told what to think.

Here's the play by play from here.

He says that he's just debating prospects and casts himself as the victim of people being mean to him.

Then tomorrow he begins the tantrums again and he flips his lid every time I say something he doesn't like.

It's cute how obsessesed he is with my takes.
I guess we really can't blame him.
 

elcid

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What tool did you use @JanisJubilee? Like you mentioned yourself I was surprised to see Bush with your first pick, but come the draft I possibly see us being in such a position where the top edge and oline prospects are gone, and we seem to be reaching for a player anyway. Bush might make sense then.
 

AmishMafia

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Here's the play by play from here.

He says that he's just debating prospects and casts himself as the victim of people being mean to him.

Then tomorrow he begins the tantrums again and he flips his lid every time I say something he doesn't like.

It's cute how obsessesed he is with my takes.
I guess we really can't blame him.
I have always though he was just a very opinionated adult with a lack of appropriate communication/debate skills. I have mostly been ignoring his posts. Recently, I started to think, he may be much younger and perhaps learning/emotional issues. I am going back to ignore posts or just no commenting/interaction.
 
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GleefulGary

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What tool did you use @JanisJubilee? Like you mentioned yourself I was surprised to see Bush with your first pick, but come the draft I possibly see us being in such a position where the top edge and oline prospects are gone, and we seem to be reaching for a player anyway. Bush might make sense then.

The draft network.
 

Dantés

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To pull this thing back on track...

Ben Fennell is one of my favorite Twitter follows. He is one of the best in the media in terms of tape study and he shares a lot of what he's seeing. He spends a lot of time on the Packers. A couple weeks ago, he had a post that caught my eye.

After reviewing the season on film, his opinion is that the top need for the Packers is range and play-making ability from the 2nd level (ILB).

Blake Martinez is a pretty good player. The general opinion of him is probably higher than where it ought to be. I would blame his PFF grade for that. It's been relatively high because Martinez is relatively good at what he's asked to do. But it doesn't take into consideration what Martinez can't do, which is range to the sidelines and make plays in the passing game.

This is not PFF's fault. It's just the nature of putting grades on players. Understanding what type of play is being graded is just as important as understanding the grade itself. For example, Mike Pennel (iDL, NYJ) carries a grade from last season of 87.1. That sounds great on the surface... until you realize that Pennel was/is a bit part player who only really factors on running downs.

So all of that to say, it makes sense to me that someone would assess the film and come away feeling that LB is a big need despite the Packers having a highly rated player at the position.

That then raises some questions. The first that comes to mind is: what's the plan for Oren Burks and Josh Jones? It's unclear whether Jones will fit in long term in a S role or at LB. He's a fast, explosive player, but he lacks the fluidity that you'd ideally want to see in coverage. He was also drafted by the previous GM, so it's possible that Gute & Co aren't committed to finding him a home if he doesn't make big improvements.

Burks, on the other hand, was drafted by this FO (and in the top 100, no less). He possesses all the athleticism that you want. He's long, fast, and fluid. However, he spent a lot of time in college switching positions, so the book on him coming out was that he would need time to settle into one spot and get comfortable.

That last part is why it's so tricky to assess this need. Burks didn't play a lot in 2018 and he wasn't very good when he did. But when he was always supposed to need a redshirt year, it's hard to know for certain why that was. Is he just developing? Or is he just not good?

And so we come to the draft supply of linebackers. There are two that stand head and shoulders above the class-- Devin Bush and Devin White. Both would upgrade the position in a big way. I prefer Bush, much like JJ. So if the Packers want to upgrade the spot, it's probably going to have to be in the 1st round or not at all. But would they do that if they still believe in Burks? That's hard to say. I suppose it's possible that they draft one of the two to play next to Martinez in 2019, replace him in 2020, and leave that door open for Burks to still fill that 2nd LB role after Martinez leaves.
 

PackFan2

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Or is he just not good?

And so we come to the draft supply of linebackers. There are two that stand head and shoulders above the class-- Devin Bush and Devin White. Both would upgrade the position in a big way. I prefer Bush, much like JJ.
Burks just aint that good. Would love Devin Bush Jr on the team. Solid football IQ and sharp instinct. I can see him taking over for Martinez if we don't resign him.

I'd love to pick up a late round RB. I know we have Jones and Williams but I absolutely think Rodney Anderson will be the RB gem of the draft. Soo pis*d last year when all the teams passed on Philip Lindsay. Sad he didnt come to GB. It would solve our return game too. Talking about return game. Maybe an Andy Isabella or Mecole Hardman. Next is just waiting for pro days to find gems.
 

Dantés

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Burks just aint that good. Would love Devin Bush Jr on the team. Solid football IQ and sharp instinct. I can see him taking over for Martinez if we don't resign him.

I'd love to pick up a late round RB. I know we have Jones and Williams but I absolutely think Rodney Anderson will be the RB gem of the draft. Soo pis*d last year when all the teams passed on Philip Lindsay. Sad he didnt come to GB. It would solve our return game too. Talking about return game. Maybe an Andy Isabella or Mecole Hardman. Next is just waiting for pro days to find gems.

I don't think we can know that yet.

However, I do think that if they love Bush or White, Burks isn't a good reason to pass on them. He could still be incorporated if he pans out.
 

PackFan2

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He could still be incorporated if he pans out.
Yeah- he'd be relegated on special teams and warming up the bench. Which, that's not a bad thing. I really think we need a special teams captain but I think the undrafted LB has it in his hands right now.

Doing a bunch of simulated drafts (via the draft network)- alot of good players falling.. I can't see us picking at 12- id trade to get more.
 

Dantés

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Yeah- he'd be relegated on special teams and warming up the bench. Which, that's not a bad thing. I really think we need a special teams captain but I think the undrafted LB has it in his hands right now.

Doing a bunch of simulated drafts (via the draft network)- alot of good players falling.. I can't see us picking at 12- id trade to get more.

I meant that if they drafted a linebacker high and Burks still panned out, he could play next to the 2019 draftee after they let Martinez walk (if they let Martinez walk).
 

AmishMafia

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I'd love to pick up a late round RB. I know we have Jones and Williams but I absolutely think Rodney Anderson will be the RB gem of the draft. Soo pis*d last year when all the teams passed on Philip Lindsay. Sad he didnt come to GB. It would solve our return game too. Talking about return game. Maybe an Andy Isabella or Mecole Hardman. Next is just waiting for pro days to find gems.
Rodney Anderson had a season ending injury 3 times in college. We need to start taking injury history more seriously in our predraft analysis. I'm all for taking a shot on him with a late pick, but if I got anything out of him, I would consider it a bonus.
 
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PackFan2

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Rodney Anderson had a season ending injury 3 times in college. We need to start taking injury history more seriously in our predraft analysis. I'm all for taking a shot on him with a late pick, but if I got anything out of him, I would consider it a bo of us.
I have him going earliest 4th to 6th round. Thing about every RBs (as an ex-high school rb) is that all have dealt with some form of injury (some cases serious injuries ex McGahee, Sayers, Bieler) and surgery. But yeah i get where you're coming from too. Shelf life of an RB is one of the shortest. We need all the talent to rotate in. This all rests on medical staff to examine.
 
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The Redskins jumping the Dolphins for a QB makes sense, but then again both have to make it to the draft without having addressed the QB need with a veteran option (e.g. Rosen or Carr if they're available). If WAS has, they won't move up. If MIA has, there's no reason to jump them.

Washington agreed to trade for Case Keenum some days ago.

Blake Martinez is a pretty good player. The general opinion of him is probably higher than where it ought to be. I would blame his PFF grade for that. It's been relatively high because Martinez is relatively good at what he's asked to do. But it doesn't take into consideration what Martinez can't do, which is range to the sidelines and make plays in the passing game.

Martinez PFF grade fell to 74.8 by the end of last season, which was good enough for 26th among qualifying inside linebackers.

I'd love to pick up a late round RB. I know we have Jones and Williams but I absolutely think Rodney Anderson will be the RB gem of the draft. Soo pis*d last year when all the teams passed on Philip Lindsay. Sad he didnt come to GB. It would solve our return game too.

Lindsay was fantastic as an undrafted rookie running back but he wasn't special returning kickoffs or punts.
 
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sschind

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Washington agreed to trade for Case Keenum some days ago.

Which tells me 2 things.

One, they are not ready to give up on Alex Smith and two, they are not sold on any of the QBs in this years draft.

On the other hand they may have given up on Smith and they feel the QB they are sold on in this years draft will need a year as a backup to be ready so they traded for Keenum as a stopgap.

So I guess now that I think about it it tells me nothing.
 

shockerx

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also could see moving back to 17 ....trading 12 and a 4th, for 17 and roughly 50. still can get top OL like Risner or ford there and add pick 50ish...45-50 is a sweet spot in this draft.
 

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also could see moving back to 17 ....trading 12 and a 4th, for 17 and roughly 50. still can get top OL like Risner or ford there and add pick 50ish...45-50 is a sweet spot in this draft.
That's a tight sweet spot. Damn the luck -we have #44!
 

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Dalton Risner would be great for us. Hoping he should still be on the board at 30.
Absolutely love the picks of Khalen Saunders and Hunter Renfrow.
Dieter is a great fit for LaFleur's scheme also.

Personally not a big fan of Winovich in all honestly, I think there are better rushers available but that is purely opinion based and hey, a lot of people like him so I may be wrong.

I honestly don't know anything about Travis Homer so will have to check him out, but wonder if you would have considered Bryce Love of Stanford at that pick instead? Packers met him at the combine and he could be available around that pick although he may be gone just before as there will be competition.

Also have to admit, I would totally take Hockerson. I realise there may be a hype train but I am all aboard waving my cap and shovelling coal in the furnace.
 

elcid

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Dalton Risner would be great for us. Hoping he should still be on the board at 30.
Absolutely love the picks of Khalen Saunders and Hunter Renfrow.
Dieter is a great fit for LaFleur's scheme also.

Personally not a big fan of Winovich in all honestly, I think there are better rushers available but that is purely opinion based and hey, a lot of people like him so I may be wrong.

I honestly don't know anything about Travis Homer so will have to check him out, but wonder if you would have considered Bryce Love of Stanford at that pick instead? Packers met him at the combine and he could be available around that pick although he may be gone just before as there will be competition.

Also have to admit, I would totally take Hockerson. I realise there may be a hype train but I am all aboard waving my cap and shovelling coal in the furnace.
We'd probably would have to give up our 3rd in order to get both #17 and #37 from NYG, but I wouldn't necessary be opposed against it if White, Gary, Oliver are off the board at #12.

These would be my picks in order of preference:

#17 Ford, Risner, Bush, Dillard, Hockenson, Burns
#30 Risner, Bush, Dillard, Hockenson, Adderley, Burns, Irv Smith
#37 Irv Smith, Hollywood Brown, Samuel, Lindstrom, Tillery, Chauncey-Gardner-Johnson
#44 Samuel, Lindstrom, Tillery, Chauncey-Gardner-Johnson, Mack Wilson, Campbell
 

Nate

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This draft has decent d-line depth and we are gonna need it. Love Wilkins and Jerry tillery.
Also a huge fan of Winovich, really fluid OLB with a high motor. He’s needs more love.

Gary and White are overrated imo
 

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