I love Ted Thompson

[PackerFlatLander]

I do wish Ted would be a little bit more open-minded when it comes to free agency. I agree 100% with not giving aging veterans big money - that cripples a team, especially one from a small market. However, this stubborn insistence on being strictly a "draft and develop" team, is seriously starting to hurt us. Take the 49ers - they give up a 6th round pick - that's right, a 6th round pick, to acquire Anquan Boldin. Um ... if they don't have Boldin, we beat them last week. Period. This is just one example of giving up a meager 6th round pick, to get a veteran player with a reasonable contract, that helps your team win and the 49ers did exactly that. There's no sugarcoating this - it's all there in black and white print in the standings.

As for the Favre circus, I took Thompson's side from day one and I'll never waver on that.

 

[PackFanNChiTown]

If Bakhtiari works out at LT then Ted is a genius. Having said that, I wish safety wasn't ignored in the off season, that's clearly biting us in the buttocks, but then again I'm just a fan(atic) that wants to see my team win the Super Bowl every year while the Bears go 0-16 so need to trust our front office guys to know what they're doing more than I do.

I agree though that we could be more active in FA, not with the Haynesworth level signings but with players that make sense in an area of need that could immediately contribute over our current starters.

Like safety.

 

[rodell330]

Ted will do nothing this yr at Safety pretty much can guarantee that. He seems like the type of guy who will let his draft picks try to pan out even if they suck. Just so he doesn't look bad. I knew in pre-season safety would be an issue, i'm sure he did to. The Jennings/McMillen eperiment should be over as neither one seems to have big play ability..up next?? Micah Hyde?

 

[El Guapo]

I think that you guys take a pretty morbid view of TT's ways. You believe that he won't do something or that he's too stingy. It's more that he won't make moves that he feels will put us in a worse spot down the road for short term gain. The talking heads around here want him to act like a Fortune 500 CEO, boosting stock prices so that everyone gets rich today but who cares about tomorrow.

A 6th rounder for Boldin? Great. Why on earth would we waste a 6th round pick on a WR when we had more pressing needs? I realize you're using it as an example, but it's a poor example. In fact it shows that he won't throw away picks if not necessary.

The salary cap makes this league a very difficult place to work. Half the threads on this forum are about how the Packers aren't elite at every position. You can't afford to be elite at all positions no matter what. However, we all know that FA cost money because your buying high. The draft and develop is about buying low and selling high (although you never actually get to the sell part unless trading).

If a free agent is available and it fits within the team's current and long-term budgets, TT makes the move. That's rare though because FAs aren't clamoring to be in Green Bay any more than the next city. They want money, and eventually it all comes down to whether it's worth stuffing FA money into a hole on the team's roster or asking the coaching staff to make the best of it (coach'em up) while the personnel department finds players through the draft and UDFA markets.

My two cents

 

[El Guapo]

Ted will do nothing this yr at Safety pretty much can guarantee that. He seems like the type of guy who will let his draft picks try to pan out even if they suck. Just so he doesn't look bad. I knew in pre-season safety would be an issue, i'm sure he did to. The Jennings/McMillen eperiment should be over as neither one seems to have big play ability..up next?? Micah Hyde?

You're about the only one (typical) that thinks/thought that neither Jennings or McMillan could be a starting safety for us. Every off-season thread was about which one would be the guy.

You always take a sour view of how a team is managed. Letting his draft picks pan out if they suck? We all know you'd rather have the Dan Snyder approach. You need to stop playing Madden and all of those fantasy games. In the real world it can take several years to develop a player. Andrew Luck is the outlier. It doesn't happen that quickly for most draft picks. Your model of general management is unsustainable and I am SO GLAD that you will never have a shot at being the GM. I'm also glad that I don't have a shot either.

 

[12theTruth]

You're about the only one (typical) that thinks/thought that neither Jennings or McMillan could be a starting safety for us. Every off-season thread was about which one would be the guy.

You always take a sour view of how a team is managed. Letting his draft picks pan out if they suck? We all know you'd rather have the Dan Snyder approach. You need to stop playing Madden and all of those fantasy games. In the real world it can take several years to develop a player. Andrew Luck is the outlier. It doesn't happen that quickly for most draft picks. Your model of general management is unsustainable and I am SO GLAD that you will never have a shot at being the GM. I'm also glad that I don't have a shot either.

What about the fact that the coaching staff didn't adequately have the backup safeties prepared? Its not like there isn't any precedent for Capers defense to be either unprepared or unable to make in game adjustments. Just go back to Woodson's comments earlier this year. Speaks volumes. Lets not rush as some do to condemn Ted Thompson for the major lack of talent at backup safety. Because of the uncertainty of Morgan Burnett playing last week, McMillian didn't have much in the way of preparation for his ultimate assignment. His play was poor but I see a rush by many to criticize the players and even Ted Thompson while defending the coaching staff.

Lets see how things play out here though. The answer will present itself as the weeks play out I'm thinking.

 

[HyponGrey]

I do wish Ted would be a little bit more open-minded when it comes to free agency. I agree 100% with not giving aging veterans big money - that cripples a team, especially one from a small market.

Giving young FA lots of money and them bumming out will cripple a team just as easily.

Ted will do nothing this yr at Safety pretty much can guarantee that. He seems like the type of guy who will let his draft picks try to pan out even if they suck. Just so he doesn't look bad. I knew in pre-season safety would be an issue, i'm sure he did to. The Jennings/McMillen eperiment should be over as neither one seems to have big play ability..up next?? Micah Hyde?

How does giving a player time to not pan out make you look good, especially when he's in the game week in and week out sucking it up? Ted trusts his coaches and is loyal to a fault. I completely disagree with your assessment. McMillian has big play ability, and has flashed. Problem is he just doesn't have the ball skills, he's a Linebacker playing Safety. Jennings doesn't have big play ability, but would at least be a suitable stopgap if he'd just pick up a weight for once in his life. Hyde won't get moved off Corner til next year.

Side note: I plead you Packnation, learn how to spell your players names. Heyward, Rogers, McMillen, Baktieri, Lacey, Burnette, Neil, Pickit, Mathews, Sitten, Francis, Mastay, Wilsen, Jared Bush, and Sheilds are not on the roster.

 

[12theTruth]

Giving young FA lots of money and them bumming out will cripple a team just as easily.


How does giving a player time to not pan out make you look good, especially when he's in the game week in and week out sucking it up? Ted trusts his coaches and is loyal to a fault. I completely disagree with your assessment. McMillian has big play ability, and has flashed. Problem is he just doesn't have the ball skills, he's a Linebacker playing Safety. Jennings doesn't have big play ability, but would at least be a suitable stopgap if he'd just pick up a weight for once in his life. Hyde won't get moved off Corner til next year.

Side note: I plead you Packnation, learn how to spell your players names. Heyward, Rogers, McMillen, Baktieri, Lacey, Burnette, Neil, Pickit, Mathews, Sitten, Francis, Mastay, Wilsen, Jared Bush, and Sheilds are not on the roster.

I don't enjoy spelling the left tackle's name . Although I may have gotten Lacey Lacy wrong, I think I'm pretty good with the rest I try to spell everything correctly but isn't to me as big of a deal as names can be tough. Try doing cold calls at an insurance agency. You'd have fun with pronunciations. LOL

 

[easyk83]

If Bakhtiari works out at LT then Ted is a genius. Having said that, I wish safety wasn't ignored in the off season, that's clearly biting us in the buttocks, but then again I'm just a fan(atic) that wants to see my team win the Super Bowl every year while the Bears go 0-16 so need to trust our front office guys to know what they're doing more than I do.

I agree though that we could be more active in FA, not with the Haynesworth level signings but with players that make sense in an area of need that could immediately contribute over our current starters.

Like safety.

I think the Packers reasonably assumed that the offseason progression of Jennings/McMillan would be sufficient for at least one of them to be relied upon. Unless we were going to grab a safety in round 1 odds are that they're about as good as what we could have gotten in the draft. Maybe next year we see a first rounder at safety.

 

[PackFanNChiTown]

Looking at the available list of free agent safeties for 2013 (AKA doing one's research prior to speaking) I notice there weren't all that many available other than Dashon Goldson and Glover Quin that were in our preferred age bracket and/or would be a significant upgrade.

 

[AmishMafia]

Looking at the available list of free agent safeties for 2013 (AKA doing one's research prior to speaking) I notice there weren't all that many available other than Dashon Goldson and Glover Quin that were in our preferred age bracket and/or would be a significant upgrade.

exactly. both McMillan and Jennings looked adequate and Richardson has potential to be an impact player. Richardson is on IR, Burnett is out and neither McM or Jenn took a step this year.

Now that we know what we know, its more than a little too late. Suppose Richardson came on like gangbusters and McM was tearing it up as well. We would be sitting here with Goldson, a player not as good as Burnett, for over $8m per year.

you can't pick and choose your TT examples after the fact. Either you accept the strategy or you don't for building the entire team.

 

[Bus Cook]

I think that you guys take a pretty morbid view of TT's ways. You believe that he won't do something or that he's too stingy. It's more that he won't make moves that he feels will put us in a worse spot down the road for short term gain. The talking heads around here want him to act like a Fortune 500 CEO, boosting stock prices so that everyone gets rich today but who cares about tomorrow.

Actually, some of us solve the elusive problem of building an O line today (or over the past 5+ years) so that AR will be here tomorrow.

A 6th rounder for Boldin? Great. Why on earth would we waste a 6th round pick on a WR when we had more pressing needs? I realize you're using it as an example, but it's a poor example. In fact it shows that he won't throw away picks if not necessary.

No its a perfect example of how there are all sorts of fantastic things that can happen when you open your eyes and mind to the potential of signing FAs.

The salary cap makes this league a very difficult place to work. Half the threads on this forum are about how the Packers aren't elite at every position. You can't afford to be elite at all positions no matter what. However, we all know that FA cost money because your buying high. The draft and develop is about buying low and selling high (although you never actually get to the sell part unless trading).

We all know this, but it doesn't mean you have to avoid one to embrace the other. Moderation is the key.

If a free agent is available and it fits within the team's current and long-term budgets, TT makes the move. That's rare though because FAs aren't clamoring to be in Green Bay any more than the next city. They want money, and eventually it all comes down to whether it's worth stuffing FA money into a hole on the team's roster or asking the coaching staff to make the best of it (coach'em up) while the personnel department finds players through the draft and UDFA markets.

Free agents don't clamor to be in any market, they clamor for money. The money they get is the market price. If you have a need and are trying to be competetive, you fill the need. Superbowl, 15-1. These aren't times to be looking to develop some punk to protect AR.

My two cents

Other than that, I think you've covered all the apologies that are typically made for TT. The guy has whiffed on the last three drafts. If you are going to live by the draft, you can't miss for three straight years.

 

[AmishMafia]

Other than that, I think you've covered all the apologies that are typically made for TT. The guy has whiffed on the last three drafts. If you are going to live by the draft, you can't miss for three straight years.

whiffed?

after 1 game, although 3 rookies are starting on a playoff caliber team, you are calling it a whiff?

You also appear to be forgetting about Daniels, Heyward and Perry from 2 years ago.

Not to mention other players like House, Sherrod, Worthy, etc, who all still may evolve and become players. In the draft and develop process, you seem to be forgetting about the develop part.

 

[Bus Cook]

I wasn't referring to this years draft. I like you have no clue as to how well any of them will work out. I don't write them off as busts nor do I brag that three of them played a whole game. I was referring to the prior three drafts, where the votes have been counted. Whiff

 

[RockyRaccoon]

I wasn't referring to this years draft. I like you have no clue as to how well any of them will work out. I don't write them off as busts nor do I brag that three of them played a whole game. I was referring to the prior three drafts, where the votes have been counted. Whiff

Wow. Really? So Nick Perry, Casey Hayward, Mike Daniels, Randall Cobb, Bryan Bulaga are all busts right? Injuries have hampered a lot of picks. Worthy, Sherrod, Neal. All could still turn out to be strong players. Exactly how many picks does a GM need to hit on in order for a draft to be successful?

 

[AmishMafia]

I wasn't referring to this years draft. I like you have no clue as to how well any of them will work out. I don't write them off as busts nor do I brag that three of them played a whole game. I was referring to the prior three drafts, where the votes have been counted. Whiff

So then you are referring to 2010:


Bryan Bulaga - one of the top ROTs in the NFL
Morgan Burnett - our best safety and several years of solid starts and steady improvement
Andrew Quarless - TE that was injured but flashed signs of greatness
Marshall Newhouse - started a whole bunch of games, remains a flexible reserve
James Starks - A KEY component in our victorious SB run
CJ Wilson - Started many games and had continually improved to be our best run stopping DE

Mike Neal - injured but has still managed to show enough to keep a spot on the roster and we may now get a chance to see what he can do.

So, every pick made in 2010 is still with the team, and you call it a whiff. Some of these players where critical in our SB victory. And you call it a whiff.

Do you want to go back another year? Be careful, then you are going to have to explain why Raji and Matthews suck.

 

[Bus Cook]

Wow. Really? So Nick Perry, Casey Hayward, Mike Daniels, Randall Cobb, Bryan Bulaga are all busts right? Injuries have hampered a lot of picks. Worthy, Sherrod, Neal. All could still turn out to be strong players. Exactly how many picks does a GM need to hit on in order for a draft to be successful?

You sight 5 players over three drafts to try to make your case. Even if I were to agree with you, five players that stick, over three years is in fact a whiff. Now let's dig deeper. Perry - hasn't shown anything yet. I too have hope for him but as of now, whiff. Hayward - same thing. Daniels - same thing. Cobb - that's a hit. BBB (broken bones bulaga) - could be the next Harrell. So if those five picks are you example of a stong three year run of draft picks, I thank you for making my case.

 

[TJV]

Hayward's a whiff, huh? That's wrong by any measure. My guess is Bus here is a favre fan who hasn't gotten over it.

 

[Bus Cook]

So then you are referring to 2010:


Bryan Bulaga - one of the top ROTs in the NFL He's a left tackle and he's on IR Again.
Morgan Burnett - our best safety and several years of solid starts and steady improvement. Our best safety. LOL
Andrew Quarless - TE that was injured but flashed signs of greatness. But=whiff
Marshall Newhouse - started a whole bunch of games, remains a flexible reserve flexible reserve = whiffJames Starks - A KEY component in our victorious SB run What is he now?
CJ Wilson - Started many games and had continually improved to be our best run stopping DE Seriously?

Mike Neal - injured but has still managed to show enough to keep a spot on the roster and we may now get a chance to see what he can do. so then so far, whiff

So, every pick made in 2010 is still with the team, and you call it a whiff. Some of these players where critical in our SB victory. And you call it a whiff.

Do you want to go back another year? Be careful, then you are going to have to explain why Raji and Matthews suck. No. That's why I posted "three years"

 

[RockyRaccoon]

You sight 5 players over three drafts to try to make your case. Even if I were to agree with you, five players that stick, over three years is in fact a whiff.

I cited the 5 strongest players from those drafts. I also cited 3 guys who have been hampered by injuries but could still be good players in this league.

Now let's dig deeper. Perry - hasn't shown anything yet. I too have hope for him but as of now, whiff. Hayward - same thing. Daniels - same thing. Cobb - that's a hit. BBB (broken bones bulaga) - could be the next Harrell. So if those five picks are you example of a stong three year run of draft picks, I thank you for making my case.

I thought Perry was looking damn good before his injury last year. And Hayward? You've got to be joking. He made a strong case for defensive ROY last year. Daniels played at least as well as you would expect from a rookie 4th rounder.

As Amish said, Starks played a key role in our Super Bowl run in 2010. Not bad for a rookie 6th rounder. Burnett isn't great, but he's a solid NFL starter.

Whiff is a strong word. Are you seriously under the impression that every pick should step in and immediately make a strong impact?

 

[13 Times Champs]

Wow. Really? So Nick Perry, Casey Hayward, Mike Daniels, Randall Cobb, Bryan Bulaga are all busts right? Injuries have hampered a lot of picks. Worthy, Sherrod, Neal. All could still turn out to be strong players. Exactly how many picks does a GM need to hit on in order for a draft to be successful?

According to Ron Wolf you should get three starters from a draft. He never said immediately. Yeah Whiff is a pretty stupid description of his drafts.

 

[Bus Cook]

According to Ron Wolf you should get three starters from a draft. He never said immediately. Yeah Whiff is a pretty stupid description of his drafts.

Well we didn't have three starters from any of the three drafts that I mentioned, who started on Sunday. Unless you mean anyone who ever started a game it just isn't so. This isn't going to turn into a thread about ifs and buts and candy and nuts is it?

 

[El Guapo]

All teams start off with 7 picks in the draft in the modern era, so 3 starters is a 42% success rate. Based on my draft records, Ron Wolf averaged 47% and Ted Thompson is at 45% - excluding the recent draft and those players from previous drafts who shouldn't be fully assessed yet due to injuries. Granted that my definition of success is different than "starters" since not all players that start multiple games for the club end up being a successful draft pick. Examples = Terrell Buckley, John Michels, Najeh Davenport, Alex Green, etc. A team is made up of 53 players with only 24 starters (including kickers) so more than half of the squad can be solid contributors/good draft picks without being a starter. Newhouse is the perfect example. He can start but he's not ideal, but for a 5th round draft choice he's a solid backup that can mostly get the job done. If the measure of success is that the player was a solid contributor (starter or backup) for more than just two or three seasons, that's a successful pick in the draft IMO.

Bart Starr had a 25% success rate in the draft
Forrest Gregg had a 32% success rate in the draft
Tom Braatz had a 33% success rate in the draft
Mike Sherman had a 24% success rate in the draft

Wolf and Thompson are mountains above the rest, and it speaks to the division titles and Super Bowl trophies under their direction.

 

[AmishMafia]

I cited the 5 strongest players from those drafts. I also cited 3 guys who have been hampered by injuries but could still be good players in this league.
I thought Perry was looking damn good before his injury last year. And Hayward? You've got to be joking. He made a strong case for defensive ROY last year. Daniels played at least as well as you would expect from a rookie 4th rounder.

As Amish said, Starks played a key role in our Super Bowl run in 2010. Not bad for a rookie 6th rounder. Burnett isn't great, but he's a solid NFL starter.

Whiff is a strong word. Are you seriously under the impression that every pick should step in and immediately make a strong impact?

Jordy Nelson, James Jones, Johnny Jolly, Nick Collins, Desmond Bishop, . . . all players who started out okay, but then became impact players after a few years. Way too soon too write off so many players. And to discount them when they appear to be steadily improving is silly.

Not mention we have gotten, not only a starter, but impact stars in Cobb and Hayward.

But I don't think there is much sense in arguing. The Bus has decided TT is bad and no number of Superbowls; prowbowl players; or other Packer success is ever going to dissuade him.

 

[13 Times Champs]

Well we didn't have three starters from any of the three drafts that I mentioned, who started on Sunday. Unless you mean anyone who ever started a game it just isn't so. This isn't going to turn into a thread about ifs and buts and candy and nuts is it?

What El Guapo said. So your definition of failure is if they didn't start last Sunday. LMAO.