I found this interesting...

[porky88]

The problem with putting the money into the future, to stay at that 10-6 level is that you never seem to get over the hump and win some playoff games. Please see the fall of Camelot in San Francisco in the late nineties early 00's. They crashed and burned hard and still haven't recovered. I think Harlan realized this was about to happen in Green Bay and made a preemtive strike by removing MS from his GM duties. I think a few influential share holders may have been kicking him in the ***, but that is only speculation on my part not fact Pyle.

Yeah, we had a miserable year last year, but it wasn't MS's fault, it wasn't TT's fault, it wasn't Brett's fault for 29 picks, and it wasn't the fault of injuries. It was the fault four collectively.

I really want to agree with you Dakota, I really do. I'm not disagreeing just to disagree but if you are a 10-6 ball club dismantling the team for the future is premature. At 10-6 you are only 2 players away from 13-3 and a serious contender. This team was a 10-6 team until TT took over. If he would have made the right moves we would have had a 10-6 team going into last year. This team HEALTHY wasn't a 10-6 team last year period. If he finds a way to re-sign Wahle going into last year and then made some minor moves this year we would have alot better chance of fielding a competitor this year while Brett's still here. You don't dismantle a 10-6 team.

Yeah, I vaguely remember guys like that. I think their names were Joe Johnson and Hardy Nickerson.

Pyle, we all wanted to keep Wahle and it broke my heart when he and Marco left, and we all no the remifications of it! But it's time to let go, man, just let it go! I promise, you'll wake up tomorrow and the birds will be singing and you only probably make those boys run 50 wind sprints instead of 100.

And using Hardy Nickerson as a free-agent flop is weak. If we are using guys like that I can easily use O'Dwyer,Little,Freeman,Thompson ......OR......Basically every Free Agent TT ever brought in.


Oh yeah, add Billy Cundiff to that list. Another GREAT TT signing

Terry Glenn didn't really work out. The money spent on Ferguson has been a bust so far. The money spent on Cledius Hunt was a bust as well. Joe Johnson as well. I think if you take Joe Johnson's contract and compare it too all the guys you named. Johnson's might be more. It's definately close.

I think a comparable bust would be Ryan Pickett or Charles Woodson (if they are a bust of a signing) Then you can compare that. In terms of saving money, that's one thing Ted Thompson has done well. We're 7.6 mil under right now.

 

[DakotaT]

What do you mean using, you've used and used and used these same guys over and over.

Don't you remember that year with Hardy, we a good year the year before, but we needed a MLB because Torrance "Dumb as a Bag of Hammers" couldn't hack it. We thought we had a shot and Sherman went out and signed Hardy who ended up being washed up! Sherman tried to sign that one guy, but it failed. Nobody said Sherman didn't try, it just always blew up in his face.

How about we root for Woodson to succeed just for sh!ts and giggles huh, but your point is noted.



Pyle I can joust with you all night,

 

[pack_in_black]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

 

[pyledriver80]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

Who the hell was asking TT to sign both? One would have been sufficient. Nobody will predict this team to go 10-6 this year but everyone will state we have more talent,depth and experience.



Thats called Chickenshit where I come from. stating stuff and not being able to back it up with any logical reasoning clearly shows your just being one-sided.

 

[Buckeyepackfan]

:sucks: :wall: :beersign: :bye: :roll: :roll: :roll:

 

[Zero2Cool]

And using Hardy Nickerson as a free-agent flop is weak. If we are using guys like that I can easily use O'Dwyer,Little,Freeman,Thompson ......OR......Basically every Free Agent TT ever brought in.


Oh yeah, add Billy Cundiff to that list. Another GREAT TT signing

Add Samkon Gado too?

 

[krd005]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

I totally disagree with you. Losing sucks.

But you may be witnessing the 1-3 yrs of bad to maybe get to the good.

 

[DePack]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

Easy to say now. I hope in December we are not yearning for the 10-6 days.

BTW....you have to be at least 10-6 to have a shot at the championships that you speak of. 4-12 won't do it. "1-3 years in the basement" doesn't exactly automatically transfer to a "few championships". Just ask Arizon, Detroit or Houston. Hell, just ask a couple Packer fans that are over 40 years old. I'm sure they'd be happy to give you a history lesson about the 70's and 80's.

 

[warhawk]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

I totally disagree with you. Losing sucks.

But you may be witnessing the 1-3 yrs of bad to maybe get to the good.

we have gone over the Wahle thing about 1000 times but the question remains how did we end up in that position in the first place?

We were something like 29th( a couple of teams were actually OVER the cap figure) as far as cap position goes.

Almost every team out there was in a position to out bid us for anyone we wanted to go after.

We had not brought in expensive FA's that caused this.

We only had a few starters from the several previous drafts and all were under their original rookie contracts.

Either we should have been in a lot better position under the cap or we should have been a whole lot stronger in many other positions then we were at that time.

 

[DakotaT]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

I totally disagree with you. Losing sucks.

But you may be witnessing the 1-3 yrs of bad to maybe get to the good.

we have gone over the Wahle thing about 1000 times but the question remains how did we end up in that position in the first place?

We were something like 29th( a couple of teams were actually OVER the cap figure) as far as cap position goes.

Almost every team out there was in a position to out bid us for anyone we wanted to go after.

We had not brought in expensive FA's that caused this.

We only had a few starters from the several previous drafts and all were under their original rookie contracts.

Either we should have been in a lot better position under the cap or we should have been a whole lot stronger in many other positions then we were at that time.

Wahle had a cap number of over $11M. Half of the team would have had to be cut to keep him.

Forget it Warhawk, I have challenged the other side to produce financials many times, and they just poo poo it. What they don't realize is that without providing these financial, a gaping whole in the credibilty of their argument remains.

 

[Packnic]

thats what weve been saying....

pyle brings up these ideas... and they are sometimes very good ideas. but without any financial tie downs, anyone can come up with good ideas.
the fact remains that you have to pay these guys and having wahle would be a great thing. hes experienced and talented, but would it be worth not being able to make any defensive signings, cutting some depth out at other positions.

i agree with pyle that no one wants to start a rookie. but it makes sense financially and if you pick the right personnel for the right scheme it can work just fine. i think these crazy long arguments are gonna be shut down by preseason week 4 when we start to come together and people wont be so freaked out by things.

 

[pyledriver80]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

I totally disagree with you. Losing sucks.

But you may be witnessing the 1-3 yrs of bad to maybe get to the good.

we have gone over the Wahle thing about 1000 times but the question remains how did we end up in that position in the first place?

We were something like 29th( a couple of teams were actually OVER the cap figure) as far as cap position goes.

Almost every team out there was in a position to out bid us for anyone we wanted to go after.

We had not brought in expensive FA's that caused this.

We only had a few starters from the several previous drafts and all were under their original rookie contracts.

Either we should have been in a lot better position under the cap or we should have been a whole lot stronger in many other positions then we were at that time.

Wahle had a cap number of over $11M. Half of the team would have had to be cut to keep him.

Forget it Warhawk, I have challenged the other side to produce financials many times, and they just poo poo it. What they don't realize is that without providing these financial, a gaping whole in the credibilty of their argument remains.

Are you serious. I hate to break it to you but there were plenty of articles stating how TT could have re-signed Wahle.


Let me get this right one more time before I get dirty. TT could NOT have resigned Wahle in any way shape or form? If this is correct please let me know so I can prove you wrong.

 

[pyledriver80]

thats what weve been saying....

pyle brings up these ideas... and they are sometimes very good ideas. but without any financial tie downs, anyone can come up with good ideas.
the fact remains that you have to pay these guys and having wahle would be a great thing. hes experienced and talented, but would it be worth not being able to make any defensive signings, cutting some depth out at other positions.

i agree with pyle that no one wants to start a rookie. but it makes sense financially and if you pick the right personnel for the right scheme it can work just fine. i think these crazy long arguments are gonna be shut down by preseason week 4 when we start to come together and people wont be so freaked out by things.

Isn't this the same thing you guys said about FA Guards. First it was without NAMES i don't have an argument, then I give you NAMES, and you revert to NUMBERS.

So now you want numbers to, then it will be pant size followed by the number of thier children X the square root of.......blah,blah, blah

 

[Packnic]

your damn right i want numbers. i want names, numbers, pros and cons on every thing. you cant just bring in whatever you want... it just doesnt work like that. for the final time... this isnt fantasy football.

do you think money is no object?!?!?! are you seriously that mentally challenged.

 

[DePack]

your damn right i want numbers. i want names, numbers, pros and cons on every thing. you cant just bring in whatever you want... it just doesnt work like that. for the final time... this isnt fantasy football.

do you think money is no object?!?!?! are you seriously that mentally challenged.

Nicnac...there have been plenty of articles written about how TT could have signed Wahle. Do some research. Just because people don't want to spend their whole day trying to educate the cognitively disabled doesn't mean they can't.

Wahle himself stated that TT could have, but never tried to, re-sign him.



Look it up :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[pyledriver80]

your damn right i want numbers. i want names, numbers, pros and cons on every thing. you cant just bring in whatever you want... it just doesnt work like that. for the final time... this isnt fantasy football.

do you think money is no object?!?!?! are you seriously that mentally challenged.

Nicnac...there have been plenty of articles written about how TT could have signed Wahle. Do some research. Just because people don't want to spend their whole day trying to educate the cognitively disabled doesn't mean they can't.

Wahle himself stated that TT could have, but never tried to, re-sign him.



Look it up :lol: :lol: :lol:

They know it, they just want to keep trying to dodge the obvious. First they wanted names, so I gave them names. When that happened they ignored it and went on to another excuse. It's pitiful.

 

[Packnic]

what a clever nick name... im sorry, is this 1st grade again?

 

[pyledriver80]

what a clever nick name... im sorry, is this 1st grade again?

Yeah kind of like Pyleland huh?

 

[DePack]

what a clever nick name... im sorry, is this 1st grade again?

Yep....you're gonna have to go back two years!

 

[DakotaT]

Yeah kind of like Pyleland huh?

I hope that is a financially stable country because I doubt you will see much tourism! :lol:

 

[porky88]

Are you serious. I hate to break it to you but there were plenty of articles stating how TT could have re-signed Wahle.

I'd like too see it. I live in Green Bay, read the paper every day. I go to ESPN.com and read everything on there and not once did I see an article that gave absolute $$$ facts to how GB could've kept Wahle.

I think Rivera could've been kept but GB didn't have 11.5 mil up front to give to Wahle. I did read Rivera wanted too stay and woud've accepted less money but never got a contract offered.

 

[DakotaT]

10-6 this, 10-6 that. What was our playoff record under Sherman? I would rather spend 1-3 years in the basement and win a few championships then go through all the hype of a 10-6 season every year just to lose in our first playoff round. And BTW, the cap was an absolute disaster, thanks to Sherman. Sux to see Marco and Wahle go, but seriously, how could we have resigned both of them, and brought in 2 or three more free agents with where the cap was?

I totally disagree with you. Losing sucks.

But you may be witnessing the 1-3 yrs of bad to maybe get to the good.

we have gone over the Wahle thing about 1000 times but the question remains how did we end up in that position in the first place?

We were something like 29th( a couple of teams were actually OVER the cap figure) as far as cap position goes.

Almost every team out there was in a position to out bid us for anyone we wanted to go after.

We had not brought in expensive FA's that caused this.

We only had a few starters from the several previous drafts and all were under their original rookie contracts.

Either we should have been in a lot better position under the cap or we should have been a whole lot stronger in many other positions then we were at that time.

Wahle had a cap number of over $11M. Half of the team would have had to be cut to keep him.

Forget it Warhawk, I have challenged the other side to produce financials many times, and they just poo poo it. What they don't realize is that without providing these financial, a gaping whole in the credibilty of their argument remains.

Are you serious. I hate to break it to you but there were plenty of articles stating how TT could have re-signed Wahle.


Let me get this right one more time before I get dirty. TT could NOT have resigned Wahle in any way shape or form? If this is correct please let me know so I can prove you wrong.

I am serious, I read a lot of articles that I don't believe. Wahle said this, Wahle said that, Money talks pyle, and you don't keep players of his caliber without it.

TT could have kept Wahle, but at what cost. Go through the numbers and bring it to us. We had less then $2 M in cap space and Wahle's cap # was over $11M. Go to GM PYLE!


Here's a Roy Rogers quote for you "All I know is what I read in the newspaper"

 

[pyledriver80]

Isn't Ted thompson the same guy that signed MS to a contract extension last year? There's a hint.

Green Bay - It came as somewhat of a surprise to guard Mike Wahle that the Green Bay Packers did not attempt to keep him under the terms of the remaining three years of his contract, but he said the hiring of general manager Ted Thompson in January changed everything.

Advertisement

Instead of paying Wahle a $6 million roster bonus in March and base salaries of $5 million this year, $1.5 million in ’06 and $1.0 million in ’07, the Packers released him. After they did, they attempted to lure him back, but they stopped well short of the five-year, $27 million contract he received from the Carolina Panthers, which included $11.5 million in bonuses over the first year.
Wahle, whose new team is preparing for a game against his old team Monday night in Charlotte, said Wednesday that if coach Mike Sherman were still the general manager he probably would still be with the Packers.

“To be honest with you at the beginning of the off-season I was under the impression that they were just going to extend that contract that I was on,â€

 

[DakotaT]

Isn't Ted thompson the same guy that signed MS to a contract extension last year? There's a hint.

Green Bay - It came as somewhat of a surprise to guard Mike Wahle that the Green Bay Packers did not attempt to keep him under the terms of the remaining three years of his contract, but he said the hiring of general manager Ted Thompson in January changed everything.

Advertisement

Instead of paying Wahle a $6 million roster bonus in March and base salaries of $5 million this year, $1.5 million in ’06 and $1.0 million in ’07, the Packers released him. After they did, they attempted to lure him back, but they stopped well short of the five-year, $27 million contract he received from the Carolina Panthers, which included $11.5 million in bonuses over the first year.
Wahle, whose new team is preparing for a game against his old team Monday night in Charlotte, said Wednesday that if coach Mike Sherman were still the general manager he probably would still be with the Packers.

“To be honest with you at the beginning of the off-season I was under the impression that they were just going to extend that contract that I was on,â€

 

[pyledriver80]

This article CLEARLY states it COULD have happened, I guess you never heard of restructuring deals, trades, etc.

There were dozens of possible scenarios. Didn't Teddy wrap up about 3 Mil. a year on Shermans two year contract, only to let him go after one. Cletidus's injury settlement didn't help. The 800,000 signing bonus he gave Klemm is laughable. Resigning Martin was a joke. O'Dwyer was paid a pretty penny to do nothing.....on and on and on


If you are that near-sighted and uncreative I pity you. Do you have a brother named Ted?