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Fire Capers

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by azrsx05, Sep 9, 2012.

  1. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    3rd downs.....4 for 13

    Tell me that offense played good ?
     
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  2. PFanCan

    PFanCan That's MISTER Cheesehead, to you.

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    That info is between Mark Murphy and myself. Hope he listens to me. If I post it here, Viking lurkers will pass the intel on. :)
     
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  3. Rodgers in the House

    Rodgers in the House Cheesehead

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    The offense stank in the second half because MM does not know how to go for the jugular and start killing teams. He never gets mad and plays too conservatively. That's why we lose. There is no fire in this team whatsoever this year. We should've easily put up another 21 in the second half and called it a day. I'm tired of this classy good guy crap when your face is constantly being punched in. Gets you nowhere.
     
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  4. mradtke66

    mradtke66 Cheesehead

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    I think our offense laid an egg for one reason: Benson.

    This year, it appears we go as he goes. I only have guesses why the offense is getting it done, but running with Benson is helping us. A lot. When he got hurt, the Colt's defense got comfortable and we ended up in trouble.

    As far as my guesses on the offense, it's either the loss of Philbin or the loss of Wells/addition of Saturday.

    I really think Saturday is hitting an unfortunate combination of details. He's a little small and he's getting old. He beat small with smart previously, but he's new to our scheme and can't fall back on smart. The line is otherwise intact and yet they appear to be playing worse than last year.

    Even more confusing, is last year's weak link, Newhouse, has played pretty well and Bulaga has laid a couple of eggs.
     
  5. 13 Times Champs

    13 Times Champs Cheesehead

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    The Colts went into the game with less talent and an OL that was mangled and got more mangled. No excuses.
     
  6. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Staring with the 2nd half of Seattle the Pack didnt really give up any sacks...

    1st half today no sacks..2nd half all went to hell

    About 8 quart/ 2 full games Saturday no issues..but in one half Saturday had all these issues?
     
  7. mradtke66

    mradtke66 Cheesehead

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    You're missing a key part of my argument--the running game.

    Right now, the offense is dependent on Benson. Those 8 quarters featured his runs. He kept the chains moving and shook defenses out of a 2-deep shell. Losing him today was probably the difference.

    This dependence on Benson is why I start looking at Saturday. It was the norm last season to offense to do pretty much whatever they wanted throwing the ball even lacking the running game. Obvious exceptions the Chiefs and Giants.

    This year, we just can't. What changed? Philbin is probably part of it, but we're giving up more pressure this year with 4 out of the 5 same starters on the line. Bulaga in particular is much worse. Why? Worse communication? Possible. Sitton having to help Saturday more, leaving Bulaga without help? Possible. In my mind, a lot of that kind of blame falls on the center. Of course, Bulaga could have an injury or something, but he went from possibly the best right tackle in football last year to possibly the worst this year. Something is going on there.

    Losing Wells hurt. I'm not saying we should have kept him, we might not have been able to match his requirements. He might have just wanted out because of losing his spot to Spitz in 2008(?). We had to scramble to replace him. I figured Saturday would get us through a season and we'd draft the center of the future in 2013. I'm not sure he make it through the season after watching him so far. Not that EDS would be better, but there isn't improvement, was choice do they have?
     
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  8. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    your key point was never mentioned

    But I do agree with Benson they seem to be a lot better
     
  9. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    On empty

    Capers admitted that his team might have run out of gas in the fourth quarter given all the plays the Colts ran.
    In a game that lasted 3 hours 38 minutes, Indianapolis ran an astounding 89 plays on offense. That's almost 30 plays above the league average heading into Week 4.
    "Up front, we had B.J. go down after very few plays early," Capers said. "So you're talking about a guy like Mike Neal who was out there for the first time. He played more probably than what we anticipated."
     
  10. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    Still no answer to who we replace Capers with. Quite frankly, until we have the next guy lined up, this thread is pointless. Do we switch from 3-4 to 4-3? Depends on who we replace Capers with. Anybody have ANY ideas on who to hire in Capers' stead? Trgovac is the obvious choice, Moss as AHC theoretically would be next in line, but I think Perry deserves the shot. BTW if we go back to 4-3, kiss Greene goodbye.

    I'm willing to give Capers til the end of the year before forcing him into retirement.
     
  11. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    The entire team is in disarray right now. The coaches are not calling to snuff, and the players are also struggling to execute. The philosophy among the coaches seems to be the same as the one propogated by one Ketchman: if you have good players, it doesn't matter what you call. Offense can't sustain a drive to get the ball rolling, defense gets tired because it's always on the field. As for me, I'll take the injury cop out for now, Raji out makes our D one dimensional, Benson out makes our O one dimensional, we got Indy at a bad time, wave of emotion. I now am forced to face the reality of last season, a veteran offense playing against defenses filled with rookies who had no offseason. I guess the consensus is "Let's just not have a DC and let the players do whatever they want! or My hamster's :poop: would make a better DC!" I give Capers til the end of the year, heck, it may just be an off year, but until I have new staff lined up, I make no cuts.
     
  12. kiwitexansfan

    kiwitexansfan Cheesehead

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    This thread feels eerily familiar.

    Here I was thinking he was a good defensive co-ordinator but terrible head coach.
     
  13. ThxJackVainisi

    ThxJackVainisi Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    IMO if McCarthy fired Capers – which is not going to happen in-season – his next move would have to be firing the OC and by that I don’t mean Clements: I mean McCarthy himself, who is the de facto OC. And of course that’s not going to happen either but in my view the offense has been more responsible for the team’s struggles than the defense. And regarding the offense, the rushing stats from last year to this are similar to this (attempts and average per) but Rodgers’ passer rating has dropped almost 20% from 122.6 to 99.3. Passer rating isn’t the end-all, be-all passing stat and the drop isn’t all on Rodgers but it indicates to me which part of the offense is more responsible for the lack of consistency we’ve seen.

    As an aside, I don’t believe a fan, HC, or even GM has to have a replacement picked and ready to take over for it to make sense to fire someone on the staff. For example, when Ron Wolf took over as GM he quickly determined that the “country club” atmosphere Infante and his staff allowed on a crap team required his firing. At that moment he probably had Holmgren or others (Parcells?) in mind as a replacement but if neither ended up being available (another team could have thrown a lot more money at Holmgren, for example), it still made sense to fire Infante. Having said that, this does not apply in-season. In-season you HAVE to have a replacement ready immediately and you don’t have weeks to get an outsider up to speed. So it would have to be a defensive assistant. Which unit of the D (DL, LB, DB) has shown such outstanding coaching as to warrant the promotion of one of the assistants? So IMO this thread title as applied to an in-season change at DC is as irrelevant as the thread suggesting a Finley/Johnson trade.

    I’ve suggested a change to the offensive game plan going forward because I think McCarthy has to attempt to make Rodgers more comfortable in an effort to get him back to his pin-point accuracy of last year. But for those who harshly criticize McCarthy’s schemes consider this: Every time an open receiver drops the ball and every time an open receiver is under- or over-thrown, the members of the staff who prepared the game plan and the play caller did their jobs. The same goes for Capers when a receiver is doubled and still makes the catch. And I don’t think fan criticism of Capers sending “all out” blitzes a certain number of times is justified because in hindsight they didn’t work. Had he not done so other fans and perhaps the same fans – with perfect hindsight - would have criticized the lack of all out blitzes.
    Thank goodness McCarthy doesn’t “get mad”; coaching with excessive emotion is at best short-lived and generally foolish: Much better to coach with one’s brain. And of course this is the same coach whose team beat opponents on average by 12.6 points/game last season. Saying he doesn’t know how to go for the jugular is directly contradicted by the 2011 season. For example, on the opening drive of the second half against the Colts on third down McCarthy’s play call wasn’t too conservative. According to Rodgers that pass for a first down got (barely) tipped. That wasn’t a conservative call, it just didn’t work out.
     
  14. 12theTruth

    12theTruth Guest

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    I'd fire Capers based largely on the crap defense that he coordinated last year. They have gotten a little better this year with more pressure on QB. What the Packers fail at greatly at defense is getting individually beaten by their counterparts on the other side. Shedding blocks, out hustling the opponent, etc. Outside of harrassing Cutler for a full game and containing Luck for about a half, the defense has struggled to turn the ball over, struggled to contain the edge on running plays, etc when looked at over an entire 5 game basis.

    Woodson is in decline, Hawk is a liability in coverage, and the defensive line disappears for entire series. Those are some big obstacles to overcome for Dom. But if they fail to make the playoffs, Dom deserves to be removed along with hopefully Van Pelt and either the zone blocking scheme or Campen (take your pick).
     
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  15. Forget Favre

    Forget Favre Cheesehead

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    24 points???
    WTF!!????
    That's still not GOOD ENOUGH!
    It should have been 0, nada, nothing, zero!!!!
    You get me???
    One point is too many!
    Yeah, throw the bum Dom Capers out on his ear!
     
  16. CHIpackFAN

    CHIpackFAN Cheesehead

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    IF capers gets fired, who do you want as next DC or who wold you like to see take over?
     
  17. packerfan4ever

    packerfan4ever Cheesehead

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    Not that he would leave the Steelers but Labau sorry I know I spelled his name wrong.
     
  18. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    another fire capers thread?
     
  19. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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  20. ivo610

    ivo610 Cheesehead

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    Colts 6-3

    Packers lead league in sacks, and most likely will lead league in missing starters by the end of the season.
     
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  21. Kitten

    Kitten Feline Cheesehead Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Yet another example of how this season differs from the last. I have very little problems this year with Capers or our defense. As previous posters have pointed out, it is our offense that has struggled not our defense or it has not struggled as much as the offense. Our D has key injuries and has still managed to push past them and win games for us. I think our D is the last thing we should be complaining about, instead we should be singing their praises. I think they are the biggest reason why we have a winning record right now and have hopes of being around for the playoffs when our offense kicks it into gear.
     
  22. ThxJackVainisi

    ThxJackVainisi Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    This is from the latest article posted in the Packers.com News forum:
    In 2009, the Packers’ D was 7th in the league surrendering an average of 18.6 ppg. In 2010 the Packers D was 2nd at 15.0 ppg. In 2011, they were 19th at 22.4 ppg. So far this season Capers’ D is 11th surrendering 20.8 ppg. That averages out to 19.0 ppg over the span of Capers’ time in Green Bay and that usually puts a defense in the top 10. For fans who would fire him based upon one season out of three, what if Capers’ D ends up in the top 10 in scoring D again this season? That would be 3 seasons out of 4 in the top 10 in scoring D. At that point last year's D would look a lot more like an aberration in Capers stay in Green Bay, wouldn’t it?
     
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  23. DevilDon

    DevilDon Inclement Weather Fan

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    I don't often use stats but when I do I use yours ThxJack.
    This entire post is just nuts! I think fans at times are terminally unsatisfied. Fire Capers? Wow!
     
  24. milani

    milani Cheesehead

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    Despite the fact that we faced an anemic offense in Arizona last week you have to hand it to the defense for doing what they did with what they had on the field especially with Matthews out in the 2nd half. We were stocked with rookies and 2nd year players out there. Take away that controversial INT call in the first half and the score is much more lopsided.
     
  25. FrankRizzo

    FrankRizzo Cheesehead

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    All I Want is for our defense to pitch one shutout a season. I Thought we had a chance with home games vs Jacksonville (missing MJD) and Arisona (who almost got shut out by SF at home the week prior).

    But bottom line in this business is the W or L. We got 2 W's.

    Capers is nowhere near Dicky LeBeau as a DC, but he's still pretty good.
     

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