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Favre vs Rodgers debate here only/Anything Favre Here only

Discussion in 'The Atrium' started by wizard 87, Oct 5, 2008.

  1. RFF

    RFF Cheesehead

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    Farve-ing It

    Robert Irsay, Carlos Boozer, Roger Clemens, Johnny Damon, Nick Saban,Clay Bennett, Jose Canseco and Jim Bouton.

    I recognize in thieves, traitors and murderers, in the ruthless and the cunning, a deep beauty-a sunken beauty. — Jean Genet

    Where some might see beauty, I only see ugliness.

    Cold, bitter, ugliness.. the kind of ugliness that can only be found in a lover scorned, a false god fallen, a traitor among comrades.

    There are other famous cavets in sports.. Pulling a Buckner, doing the Bartman, don’t be Van de Velde, No Mas, Hoching It..

    And now you can add Farve-ing it.

    http://www.lansingsportsrage.com/index. ... &Itemid=83

    Brett Farve had the football world at his fingers..
     
  2. retiredgrampa

    retiredgrampa Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    I'm finding it more and more difficult to believe that there are so many "fans" who will alway denigrate Aaron Rodgers simply because he replaced a very reluctant Brett Favre. Obviously, they must be Favre fans, not Packer fans. There are two areas where Rodgers far exceeds Favre...and that is in maturity and intelligence. Rodgers has already shown that winning or losing, he will NOT lose his poise and start playing outside of himself. As he stated in a recent interview, one thing he continually emphasizes in QB meetings is never to pre-determine who you're going to pass the ball to.... You go through your progressions. In a pinch, Favre became notorious for going to Driver, come hell or high water. The trouble is the D knew that also, and it cost us.
    For all his talents, Favre only won one SB with us in all those years. But he wasn't even MVP in that game. QBs most often get that award with a win. I feel sorry for all of you who refuse to get on board with this team simply because you can't accept the fact that Favre waffled his way out of GB. He thought GB wouldn't dare go on w/o him. He lost that bet big time and his recent actions show how much his immaturity is affecting him. Before he's done, I'm quite sure there will be very few fans who care about Favre at all. Maybe even some on this board.
    So come on, if you're real Packer fans and enjoy the 1st year of the new Packers. Aaron Rodgers will be our QB for many years...surely no one should hang onto hatred that long. Hatred only harms the hater.
     
  3. PackerFan4

    PackerFan4 Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Well spoken, retiredgrampa. Look...I've seen enough of Favre this year to see that he's not playing well. I'll admit...he's still learning himself with his new team, new offense, and to do that at 38-39 years old is rough...because you're so set in your ways. But he made some errors in that Raiders game, and it cost them eventually. I'm not saying Aaron Rodgers hasn't made HIS mistakes either...he's still learning on the job, and he still has a tendency to hold onto the ball too long, but he's a different beast than Favre. He'll go through is checkdowns, take what the defense gives him, and keeps the team moving. Look at the long sustained drives against Indy. Favre just had the uncanny abillity to make things happen in a pinch, and that's why we loved the guy. But look...he's gone. I accepted that a long time ago. I'm extremely happy with Rodgers, and he's exceeded my expectations. He's also showing his toughness by playing through pain, and STILL throwing that ball downfield with zip. This team has some injuries and inconsistencies that they need to work on...but I still feel very good about this team.

    Times change, THINGS change...and face it, folks: If it didn't happen THIS year, it was gonna happen EVENTUALLY. We ALL knew the Brett Favre era in Green Bay was coming to an end--it just happned a bit sooner than many had anticipated. Look, for 17 years...we were spoiled rotten with him. But the fruit turned bad, and things changed. We've got a new sherriff in town and his name is Aaron Rodgers. Give the kid a break...he's busting his butt out there, and the VERY LEAST we as PACKERS fans can do...ESPECIALLY all you Favre fans...is get on board and SUPPORT this team. I think THEY deserve that.
     
  4. Ey3ronic

    Ey3ronic Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Favre is a legend and he put this franchise back on the map for the last 17 years. Packer fans stuck by Favre through his interception records and bad decisions that cost Green Bay many games. The fact of the matter is though Favre is a 3 time MVP and a hall famer and led this team to a Superbowl title and many winning seasons. Aaron is playing great in his first year at QB and surprisingly enough he is playing better than Brett. People need to face it that Brett didn't win all those games by himself and was surrounded by loads of talent. Rodgers has the capability to surpass Favre's legend in Green Bay just judging by his decisions and his turnovers so far this year. I'm excited to see what the future holds for Rodgers and this pack team but judging so far it looks like mean old TT made the right decision handing over this team to Aaron
     
  5. jaybirdknows

    jaybirdknows Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Well stated Ey3ronic!
     
  6. starr15

    starr15 Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    in my opinion,rodgers is way better.brett favre takes hits when there aint no 1 open,aaron rodgers will take the risk of injury and run right into linebackers,aaron rodgers is also a good deep ball as well!
     
  7. SouthPackFan78

    SouthPackFan78 Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Favre looks like crap today and last week. His supporting cast is no where near as good as what Green Bay has.Rodgers has been solid aqnd gives the Packers stability for years to come.
     
  8. retiredgrampa

    retiredgrampa Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Now if we could only find a running game, very few, if any, teams could stop us. I watch these other games, mostly out of boredom...but I am a bit surprised by the high number of really fine RBs in this league. Surely not every team has great blocking by the OL. These RBs put it all out there every carry and often get yardage by smart running and great effort. Perhaps I'm too picky but I have next to no confidence in Grant and Jackson. I wonder if they could make most of the teams in the league.
     
  9. flapackfan

    flapackfan Cheesehead

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    Re: Favre vs Rodgers debate here only.

    Agreed, Rodgers is WAY better. The Jets would be 7-0 with Rodgers in there even with only 3 weeks of preparation in the Jets offense. Favre should have retired 10 years ago. Plus, at 39 years of age, Favre should be at his best.

    /sarcasm
     
  10. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Millen told Brett who leaked the info

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/w ... ek8/3.html


    Peter King wrote:


    I think I've got this piece of old business from the Favre-Matt Millen-Packers love triangle broken last week by Jay Glazer on FOX:

    Millen told Favre last week that Detroit defensive coordinator Joe Barry was the source 4 the story that Favre discussed Packer offensive stuff with Millen.


    Barry has declined to comment on the story. I have tried to reach Millen, without success.

    I did speak to Favre last week. He is steadfast that he gave the Lions nothing of substance, including the kind of code words a quarterback would say at the line that would indicate an audible or specific change of play, and is adamant that what FOX called "a 90-minute dissertation on every single thing that the Green Bay Packers do on offense'' never happened. Without Millen's side of the story, I can't substantiate that one way or the other.
     
  11. ElleBlue

    ElleBlue Cheesehead

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    Re: Millen told Brett who leaked the info

    I wonder why Barry would come leak this info? Couldn't this get him into trouble as well? Perhaps he's angry at Favre, because Favre didn't really give him anything of substance? Who knows? These media games are crazy.
     
  12. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    The real story here is what was the motive of the Lions' DC Barry to leak this conversation to Glazer in the first place? I seriously doubt Brett told Detroit anything they didn't already know. But why did Barry tell Glazer? Did he want to make Brett look petty and vengeful? :p

    I must say this thread is the most civil discussion about Brett leaving that I've seen on any Packer forums. Most of them are full of name calling and vulgarity! :eek: :(
     
  13. starr15

    starr15 Cheesehead

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    so right now,so many people favor farve over rodgers.who has more td's,less interceptions,and more yards.as long with the fact that aaron has played 1 game other than this season!favre has been playing 17 years.pathetic.
     
  14. biesc8801

    biesc8801 Cheesehead

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    why does this debate have to continue. Can people just get over it, it's always finger pointing. Everybody hears something different about what the packers organization did or favre did. Get over it people, favre plays for the jets now and a true packer fan will not pick the jets over their own team. Favre is a legend but wasn't the whole team. It's over, rodgers is now our qb and as loyal fans should, we have to support him. This whole debate is rediculous. Move on people, stubborness won't get you anywhere. Go Pack!
     
  15. RobJohnson

    RobJohnson Cheesehead

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    Yeah...

    AROD really lit it up out there today, didn't he?

    :lol:
     
  16. wischeez

    wischeez Cheesehead

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    Apparently you can't see the forest for the trees. The Oline couldn't block my grandmother. If they could, Rodgers would probably not be running for his life in every game. They can't run block for dog doo either.
     
  17. RobJohnson

    RobJohnson Cheesehead

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    You mean the same line that Favre went 14-4 behind last year....

    Man..the whiny excuses to prop up Rodgers are getting real thin, man.

    Face it, AROD sucks, and so does TT.

    He made the wrong choice of QB's....

    The upside is that TT will be fired sooner, and the Packers can get better.
     
  18. OHIOFAN

    OHIOFAN Cheesehead

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    Rodgers has as much talent as any qb in the league. The supporting cast around him is playing very poor. The o-line can't block, we can to run the ball worth a darn (very seldom can we run the ball to get a first down when it is 3rd and 3 or 4). The team is very one predictable, our running game is a joke so the teams are pressuring the crap out of Rodgers and not allowing plays to develop. Rodgers is very good at slant routs and he is dependent on timing and rhythm- if you are running for your life every play, how do you establish rhythm. The special teams are very, very poor. They might run a kick back now and then, but the average starting field position for the pack vs their competition is a joke week in and week out. The team can not punt the ball, or have a decent return without a penalty. The O-line is just terrible (worst in the league) College is playing horrible and the line just seems overwhelmed. It is pretty sad that some of the packer "fans" get down on Rodgers who keeps his composure week in and week out while running for his life and getting the snot beat out of him. How many jump balls do you think Favre would have aired out when things got tough, you knows the ball thrown off his back foot that is up for grabs. The team around Rodgers is playing about as wells as the one Favre had when the went 4-12. Rodgers kept us in the game both this week and last week. Against the Titans, that pass to Jenning was on the money to win the game, the ball was not caught and the ref. did not call pass interference. What more can Rodgers do? This week Rodgers played porely, he did not cause us to loose the game-the defense and special teams kept us in the game and Rodgers took us down for a would be game winning field goal. Crosby missed the field goal, this again is not the qb's fault. If the team could give him a few more seconds to make his read and let a play develop, you would be seeing a top 5 qb in the league. Bottom line is to some people Favre is golden and can do no wrong. I see more upside in Rodgers than was evident in Favre his first 2 years in Green Bay.
     
  19. ahasuerus99

    ahasuerus99 Cheesehead

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    People quickly brush aside the problems Rodgers has and assume that they will eventually be trained away, but I wouldn't count on it. His glaring shortcomings have all the hallmarks of being career-defining. Many quarterbacks have started well only to have defenses figure them out. I fear that this is what is happening to Rodgers. His first major shortcoming is that he doesn't have the feel for the pocket that great quarterbacks have. This is most obvious from his inability to roll out when necessary and to step up when necessary. He tends to go backward, as is most evident from the terrible sack he took when he had dropped ten yards back. This sack was his fault, not the line's. When you drop back that far the outside linebackers have an angle on you that no lineman can take away. That is basic high school football, let alone professional. He never does his line any favors; this is the big difference between the line play of last year and this year. Favre was able to react to the rush and move to the location he was least likely to be sacked. Rodgers just hopes that no one will hit him. Add to this the fact that he holds the ball low half the time, which slows his setup and release, and you have a quarterback who is just asking to be sacked. Football is a game of seconds, when you add half a second to your release you are not doing your linemen any favors. The sad thing is that Rodgers is getting worse about this rather than better as the season progresses, and I think that McCarthy sees it. McCarthy has obviously lost faith in Rodgers as his quarterback. The best evidence of this was his unwillingness to try to get better field position at the end of the Vikings game. If he had any trust in Rodgers at all, he would not try two running plays and a screen, basically running out the last minute and a half of the clock to try a 52 yard field goal. If you look at the breakdown of games, it is not the running game or the offensive line that has been responsible for most of these losses. It was Rodgers. He played horribly in four of the five losses (excepting the Atlanta loss). Rodgers is yet to carry the team on his back to a victory. If you compare this to Favre, Favre has been responsible for two losses (New England and Oakland) but has carried his team to two victories (Miami and Arizona). Last year, Favre was only responsible for three losses the entire season (Chicago twice and Dallas), but carried them to three victories (San Diego, Minnesota, and Denver). All the excuses to be offered for Rodgers can be boiled down to one valid one: he is inexperienced. But to pretend that the offensive line is worse than it was last year presupposes that it is a numbers game and doesn't take into account how much better Favre's instincts were (it is basically the same line, and especially remember Favre's near preternatural ability to switch to the short slant in the face of the blitz, something Rodgers seems unable to do). Blaming the lack of a running game falls flat as well, as the Packers had no running game the first half of the season last year. Also, this ridiculous clinging to Rodger's quarterback rating does no one any good. Quarterback Rating underrepresents the most important stat, how often you put the ball in the endzone. The Jets score more offensive points than the Packers (228 to 181, a difference of over 5 points a game, and the Pack is scoring almost four less points per game on offense than they did last year), and there is little room to argue that Favre has more talent around him than Rodgers. After all, the Rodgers defenders like to point out that we have one of the best receiving corps in football, it is basically the same offensive line, and it's the same running back who went for five yards a carry last year. I'm sorry, the numbers and the impressions are against Rodgers. All the Favre-haters have is their belief that Favre would have lost every game that Rodgers did, because he would have thrown more picks, not taking into account that he also would have thrown more touchdowns (Rodgers is on pace for five fewer touchdowns than Favre threw last year, and Favre is on pace to throw the same amount for the Jets he threw last year for the Pack, even learning a new offense). The best argument for getting rid of Favre, in fact the only argument, is the future. It may be that Rodgers will be a great quarterback in the future. But as for this year's team, Favre is still a better quarterback than Aaron Rodgers. He is still a better leader than Aaron Rodgers (or are we to discount the win/loss record of the Jets simply because it indicates Favre's positive aspects?). Having him on the field would have given the Packers a chance at the Super Bowl this year. With Rodgers, they have a chance at a playoff berth, nothing more. And certainly, having Favre on the field would have meant trying to win the game against the Vikings, instead of running twice, a screen play, and a 52 yard field goal attempt.
     
  20. thepackattack

    thepackattack Cheesehead

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    THIS NEEDS TO END... No more debate. Rodgers is the QB now and of the future. Favre is the past. LEts Move on!
     
  21. wizard 87

    wizard 87 Packer Addict

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    this section was put up for debate. If you don't want to debate it then read another topic.
     
  22. Pugger

    Pugger Cheesehead

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    If BF had stayed retired we wouldn't have this debate. As long as he plays in NJ or elsewhere AR will be compared to him week by week. I kinda feel sorry for AR. It isn't easy to replace a legend - just ask all the QBs we went thru after Starr retired. But the icon AR is following is still playing.

    AR has made mistakes this year like every young QB does. His biggest weakness right now is he hangs onto the ball too long and doesn't have a feel for the pocket pressure. Is this something QBs are born with or is it something they acquire over the years? I think it is something QBs learn as they play. When BF first started to play regularly he did some boneheaded things. I remember folks were calling for his benching back then. You could see Holmgren aging before our eyes with the stuff BF used to do. BF admitted once that it took him 3 years before he knew what the h3ll he was doing. So comparing these 2 players is folly at this point in each man's career. Let's go back to this debate after AR has 17 years under his belt.
     
  23. JbShell

    JbShell Cheesehead

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    He tends to go backward, as is most evident from the terrible sack he took when he had dropped ten yards back. This sack was his fault, not the line's. When you drop back that far the outside linebackers have an angle on you that no lineman can take away. That is basic high school football,



    Ohhh K Coach Most people also know that drop backs are written in. you have a certain number of step 2,3,4,5 ext. they are designed into the offense. now honestly by looking at the replays of the games. MM did not roll out Rodgers like before. Teams are not respecting the run there for play action which tend to be in the 5 to 10 yard drop range are not bitten on and teams key on that. Teams we play are now pinning the old ears back and going at it. Our o-line plays on its heal. Now Rodgers has held the ball to long it is true. that is something that willl come around. ANyone who thinks they have any insight on this boardbeyond normal visual reading is fooling themselves. To sit there and say YOU can read what kind of player he his based upon what HIGH SCHOOL COACHING is JUST PLAIN O SILLINESS
     
  24. Saint

    Saint Cheesehead

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    HELLO PACKERS!!!!
    I thought i would add my 2 cents, i hope yall dont mind. First a bit of background. Im a saints fan, live in oakgrove about 6 miles from Brett's house. I actually played against him in highschool.

    I think it was a mistake to get rid of him. Simply because you guys have an outstanding team, his leadership, and winning attitude. Now there is no doubt, you guys will be better off 3 years from now, but, you wont have the same cast of players you have now when you are in position to win the big one. When AR is ajusted to (game speed) a few years from now you guys may look back and wonder what could have been. Heck, you'd still have AR. If you'll notice, it isnt Bretts athletic abilities, or the Jets playmakers that have them ahead of thier devision. I personally believe its Brett's winning attitude and spirit that has them ahead.

    You guys take care and Go Pac!!! (long as your not playing the saints)

    P.S. Your all invited to come to www.saintsreport.com when we play yall later on in the season. Its a great atmosphere.
     
  25. retiredgrampa

    retiredgrampa Cheesehead

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    I've never been a "Favre-lover" (his wild type play in GB ticked me off) but it appears that he has greatly benefitted by the trade to the Jets. First of all, this is NOT the 2007 Jets. They revamped the OL to where it's better than the Packer's OL.(IMO). And not just the OL. Today he threw a lot of quick stuff for short gains that moved the chains. His WRs had glue fingers unlike the Titan's WRs who looked afraid of the ball. Kerry Collins spent all day surveying the field before throwing it away, so the Jet's coverage must have been great. It wasn't last year.
    If the Jets keep it up, perhaps Favre won't want to play next year for the Vikes.
     

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