So then you pick up the same kind of junk that's available now and that's your solution? Hate to break it to you but at that point in the year only bums are available, guys that probably would have been rated lower than the bums we had on roster.
Eliot Wolf / John Dorsey GM threads?/ Browns - Steelers fight
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So then you pick up the same kind of junk that's available now and that's your solution? Hate to break it to you but at that point in the year only bums are available, guys that probably would have been rated lower than the bums we had on roster.
rodell330
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With all this back and forth...what if Eliot isn't the guy after all? What if they guy in waiting is actually Ball? He spends a lot more time with TT than anyone. He's also heavily involved in the financial aspect of the Franchise. Things that make you go hmmm??
Few of us have already have mentioned this.
I question why people are so quick to want him.
My only thought us that believe he will sign free agents and do some trades.
But they really don't know
Pkrjones
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Then we'll all have something to complain about for the next 10+ years
. I'm hoping EW is a bit more liberal in his use of ALL of the tools available to a GM (draft, free agency, pilfering from others' PS, etc.). The other NFL GM's plucked from the Ron Wolf/TT tree haven't been allergic to using free agency so I think the sparing use is a quirk of TT.
rodell330
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Because people want to believe that the next guy will be more in tuned with the complaints made against TT...and that's that he doesn't use ALL the viable resources to improve the team. Not only that! When he does finally do it? It's usually a year or two too late. The mess with the ilb situation, the safety Issues, and the amount of time it took to give Rodgers a viable running game. TT gets blamed for all those things...as he should. He's the guy that's over all that.
Yea he has the Packers in Good shape as far as the Cap goes...and yes the Franchise has gone to the playoffs 8 straight years. But how many yrs of having a legit chance to win a SB have been squandered because of his methods? I count at least two. It'll be three, if they get torched in the playoffs this year through the air because he didn't address the CB issues. Yea he added some practice squad guys..but he also let imo a good corner in Hayward walk, and didn't really bring in a veteran who could help these young guy's who did not look ready to be starting corners in the NFL once Shields went out week 1!
I also blame him for the debacle at rb once Lacy and Starks got hurt as well this year. He traded for Niles Davis but then jettisoned the guy before he really even got comfortable to save a draft pick. The Michael pickup was good...but I think that was more of a stick it to the Vikings move. I'm not a big MM fan but he should get all the credit for moving Monty to rb as he was the guy who presented the ideal. I won't even talk about Tightend!! Lord knows that was also a mess for about two yrs!
I honestly don't care if it's Wolfe or Ball either way tbh. Wolfe is the popular pick because of who his father was and what he did for the Franchise as far as improving need areas. But I hope he's nothing like TT in a lot of areas. That's the honest to God truth.
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Didn't say TT didn't help. May have misinterpreted it, but
seems to imply that Favre only having one SB means there's no harm in Rodgers having only one, also.
Oohh not at all..
I was pointing out that under Wolf, Favre only has one SB win..people are so in love with Wolf, but only got one win
Half Empty
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Understand. I think, perhaps, the apparent admiration for Wolf over TT is (1) that Wolf helped bring the team out of the Dark Ages, whereas TT stepped into a successful franchise, (2) time heals all wounds, and we tend to think of most people and events in a more favorable light as memories age, and (3) it did hurt badly that the Favre teams only got the one ring, and a lot of us are thinking along the 'oh no, not again' lines.
bigbubbatd
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TT did not inherit a well run franchise. He inherited a mess left by Mike Sherman. They had made the playoffs but their drafts were awful from 2001 to 2004 and had left the cupboard very bare. Really only a couple guys from those drafts became starters.
Bagadeez04
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Guys this is what happens.
Ted Thompson finishes his contract, which is two more full seasons, and retires in 2018.
Eliot Wolf will be a GM somewhere else by that time, weather it's with San Fran or someone else.
Russ Ball is named GM.
Sorry but I don't see Murphy doing anything too risky, and I believe going with Wolf at his young age and lack of experience anywhere else constitutes risk . I understand he did a scouting report on a guy in the eighth grade or whatever but he's been insulated in Green Bay and really needs to get some seasoning to be a GM in my view.
Ted Thompson finishes his contract, which is two more full seasons, and retires in 2018.
Eliot Wolf will be a GM somewhere else by that time, weather it's with San Fran or someone else.
Russ Ball is named GM.
Sorry but I don't see Murphy doing anything too risky, and I believe going with Wolf at his young age and lack of experience anywhere else constitutes risk . I understand he did a scouting report on a guy in the eighth grade or whatever but he's been insulated in Green Bay and really needs to get some seasoning to be a GM in my view.
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Had forgotten how truly lousy the drafting was. With a logical view, point taken. However, you noted the run of playoff appearances, and I imagine (just as now), that fans felt the team was good. Certainly, TT may have had to navigate a tougher path to rebuild the roster, but he just couldn't have been emotionally viewed as the savior of a team that had made so many previous playoff appearances, unlike the gang that Wolf inherited.
bigbubbatd
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That is true. I just think people underestimate the mess that roster was and how TTs draft and develop approach really saved this franchise from a long term decline. I am well aware of his short comings but from restocking the youth on this team to drafting Rodgers and moving forward with him when many would have stayed with Favre TT has helped this franchise a ton from where Sherman had it
Pkrjones
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A scouting report on a guy in 8th grade is what you think is his resume?
http://www.packers.com/team/staff/eliot-wolf/554e5cf2-a949-4cb5-8d85-11e979ac48b3
"...he has spent more than two decades in official and unofficial capacities working as a talent evaluator. Wolf has contributed to the Packers’ draft preparations since 1993, 24 consecutive drafts overall. He has held nine NFL scouting internships – five with the Packers, three with the Falcons and one with the Seattle Seahawks."
Russ Ball hasn't done anything related to player scouting or evaluating... he's a salary cap/contract guy/administrator, only. What makes him GM material?
http://www.packers.com/team/staff/russ-ball/b42d75d1-310e-4916-9f4e-7567ed7712e0/
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Bagadeez04
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I agree that Russ Ball may not be the right man for the job, but I think going with Wolf is very risky. He's too young and his resume is more or less exclusively comprised of his time within one organization (internships look nice on a resume, but let's be honest he probably didn't do much in them). I could see him being one of those guys who gets a job as GM somewhere and does not do well, then later gets a shot somewhere else and thrives with the lessons learned.
Mark Murphy strikes me as a guy who is in the mold of a Ted Thompson. He's going to go the safest route possible, seeking to minimize risk as much as he can. To me that equals Russ Ball when you really think about it.
El Guapo
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Let's face it. Wolf is the son of GM royalty not only in Green Bay but the league. He devoted himself to it and had a lot of doors that were open when he got there. Gutekunst had to do what most of us have to do, which is kick in all of the closed doors. Some might even think that helps provide someone with wisdom and character when they have to fight for their keep. Who knows.
In my view, Wolf is a gamble. He's certainly got the pedigree and has been a personnel guy most of his adult life. I just don't know if he's gotten the real world experience. He's like that shiny car in the used car lot. It might be a steal or it may sink your dreams. There's only one way to find out, if you're willing.
In my view, Wolf is a gamble. He's certainly got the pedigree and has been a personnel guy most of his adult life. I just don't know if he's gotten the real world experience. He's like that shiny car in the used car lot. It might be a steal or it may sink your dreams. There's only one way to find out, if you're willing.
D
Deleted member 6794
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Hate to break it to you but the NFL allows teams to trade for players as well. With Shields most likely being done for good the Packers could have even afforded to trade for a #1 cornerback as well.
Then we'll all have something to complain about for the next 10+ years
According to several reports Wolf has gotten tired of Thompson rejecting most of his suggestions to bring in free agents. I would expect him to use all tools available to improve the roster as a GM.
Which would require overtrading for a player. Do you know how much such a trade would cost, try a first and maybe a second round pick for a JAG.
D
Deleted member 6794
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There's absolutely no evidence to support your claim. As an example Aqib Talib was traded for a fourth rounder.
BTW I would have been fine with giving up a first rounder for a shutdown cornerback still under contract for several seasons after this one as the Packers will have to find one next offseason.
yooperpackfan
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You, nor anyone else, could possibly know any of those things.
I see people mentioning the age thing in respects to Elliott Wolf. I just like to point out that currently in baseball some of the best and most respected General managers are young guys. Now I'm not saying young guys at the helm Will work in football, however, we live in a day and age where young guys are finding success in all forms of business. In this day and age being young should not make a rats *** bit of difference as to whether you hire somebody or not. In fact not giving a young guy a shot simply because of his age would be about the dumbest business decision on the planet.
Pkrjones
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Agree, Ogsponge. Howie Roseman was 35 when hired as GM in Philly back in 2010, and Ryan Pace (Chicago) was 37 last year.
Wolf grew up immersed in football ... "The first time I was in a war room was the Packers' 1993 draft, when I was 11 years old," he recalls. "Dad might have wanted me to stay out of the way for the first round, but I got to come in after that."
http://www.cantonrep.com/article/20150730/SPORTS/150739874
Wolf grew up immersed in football ... "The first time I was in a war room was the Packers' 1993 draft, when I was 11 years old," he recalls. "Dad might have wanted me to stay out of the way for the first round, but I got to come in after that."
http://www.cantonrep.com/article/20150730/SPORTS/150739874
The Brewers current general manager is only 34 and into years he turn the Brewers farm system from one of the worst in all of baseball to arguably the best in all of baseball definitely top three . Now whether that translate to major-league successor not only time will tell
bigbubbatd
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Who were shutdown corners available? I am sure I am missing guys but the only name I remember hearing is Joe Haden and he hasn't been a shutdown corner for a couple years. He has been injured a lot and last year was bad when healthy - 158 qb rating against in his healthy games
D
Deleted member 6794
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Roseman and Pace haven't been successful though with the Eagles not winning a playoff game over the last seven years despite assembling a dream team and the Bears going a combined 9-23 since 2015.
As I've mentioned repeatedly I don't know who was available before the trade deadline, that's Thompson's job to figure out. The Packers didn't necessarily had to acquire a shutdown corner as a decent veteran would have presented a tremendous upgrade.
which leads me to the question, do you believe he wasn't looking? I think he was. I think he's always working, even when the rest of us are sleeping or complaining about how he doesn't do certain things. I never for a second think that Ted does not look for ways to make this team better. We don't know what he does. Case and point, Julius Peppers. Who had that on their radar? Josh sitton being cut, who sniffed that one out? he's traded for guys like Grant, brought in off other teams scraps like Williams, pulled in UDFA's like Shields. He's always looking.
The difference being, they believe in their work, they stick to their plan. Just because Player X may be available for a price doesn't mean the price fits and the benefit make it worth it. I would love a shut down corner, wouldn't have minded trading for one. But i'm more like Thompson, I'll believe in the guys we have that i've already put the work in on, because I trust my work, rather than over pay for what someone else is willing to get rid of. Competing teams aren't trading away good players and the non-contenders are looking for a lot of draft picks to rebuild with. It takes a special situation to trade for a guy like that, in season, for anything other than a tremendous price. usually that entails taking on a huge contract, taking on a player that is not fitting in the locker room, or giving up a lot in terms of draft picks
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