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Does Daniels Make Raji Expendable?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by Bagadeez04, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. Bagadeez04

    Bagadeez04 Cheesehead

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    Please don't overreact to this thread title...it's just a question.

    Is Mike Daniels considered a player that can be on the field and be effective against the run? Or he just a guy to put in on sub-packages? If he continues to develop well, does he allow the Packers to think twice about giving Raji a blockbuster deal? I say this not because I think it's OK to let Raji walk, but because it seems there are so many players who will be UFAs after this season. They will be looking for areas with depth to cut guys loose (I would think).
     
  2. JBlood

    JBlood Cheesehead

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    I'd be surprised if Raji gets a "blockbuster" deal. He's playing solid, but not spectacular.
     
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  3. Sunshinepacker

    Sunshinepacker Cheesehead

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    Don't think Daniels is really a running down guy but I think the combo of Daniels and a guy like Wilson/Jolly are better than Raji (cheaper too).
     
  4. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    Personally I don't think that any contributors are expendable
     
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  5. Shawnsta3

    Shawnsta3 Cheesehead

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    I'm one of the biggest supporters of Daniels here. His pass rush skill was evident in training camp that first summer.

    With that being said, he's not the same player as Raji. I believe a tandem of players could fill in for Raji if his asking price is too high as SunshinePacker said. (Jolly, Daniels, Boyd)

    It looks right now as if Raji will be leaving us unless the market sours on him ala James Jones and Pickett is getting up there in age even if we do decide to keep him around. TT has a decision to make when it comes to DT/NT and I wouldn't be surprised to see a player currently not on this team starting there within the next two years.
     
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  6. ThxJackVainisi

    ThxJackVainisi Lifelong Packers Fanatic

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    I love the way Daniels has progressed. He needed to add strength over the off season and that’s exactly what he did. Plus the harness he had to wear last season restricted him – along with the injury itself – and now that his shoulder is 100% we’re seeing the combination of his quickness and added strength.

    If Raji leaves and a new “fat guy” isn’t added, someone will obviously line up for the snaps he was getting. But Daniels shouldn’t be asked to eat up blockers like Raji, Pickett, and Jolly are. They are a different type of DL. But the Packers play sub packages more than they play base (except against teams like the 49ers) so the better Daniels gets, the more snaps he’ll earn and he’ll be a “starter” (getting a lot of snaps) even if he isn’t on the field on the opponent’s initial offensive play. IOW, Daniels doesn’t have to make Raji expendable to be more important to the D.
     
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  7. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    SMH at the entire concept of this thread. Raji has transformed as a player, and is no longer a pass rusher He's disruptive and young, and will only get better at his CURRENT game. Pickett only has a few years left at NT, Jolly Wilson Boyd and possibly Worthy would be the ones making Raji expendable if anybody. Daniels, while he can play RE in base, will continue to be one of our Nickel rushers, where HE can excel. We're talking two completely different games/roles. It's obvious the staff want's to see Raji back, and however little the opinion of him is on this forum, Raji will likely garner a nice comp pick should we fail to reup him. I see little downside either way, save that purple is not a flattering color on large fellows.
     
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  8. B-ri

    B-ri Cheesehead

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    Packers 2014 Unrestricted Free Agents:

    B.J. Raji
    Mike Neal
    C.J. Wilson
    Johnny Jolly
    Ryan Pickett
    Sam Shields
    Jermichael Finley
    James Jones
    John Kuhn
    Evan Dietrich-Smith
    Marshall Newhouse
    Andrew Quarless
    Seneca Wallace
    James Starks
    Rob Francois

    Some tough decisions will have to be made. The entire concept of this thread isn't something to shake your head at. Good players are going to be let go. There is a reason Raji wasn't resigned last offseason.

    Now I agree that Daniels alone doesn't make Raji expendable, but a combo of two or three guys at a much lower price can do the trick. At the same time, that's also extra roster spots taken up, which TT values highly.
     
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  9. BorderRivals.com

    BorderRivals.com Cheesehead

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    Raji gets no respect from people in this forum b/c he doesn't have the flashy stats. But, he has been instrumental to our success this season. His play in the middle is a big reason why we have a top ranked rush defense and why Hawk/Lattimore have had space to make plays. He eats up blockers, keeps contain, and able to make plays at the same time. It's an under-appreciated role, but a vital one to our team's success. I think he'll get paid well this off-season. And I think the Packers would be foolish to let him go. If we don't sign him long-term, I hope we franchise him.

    And the posts about Daniels are dead on. He's a great sub-package pass threat. Let him thrive in that role.
     
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  10. GeeDogWarrior

    GeeDogWarrior 0 - 0

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    If there's several 330 + pound Nose-tackles out there that we can pick up to take over for Raji and Pickett after this year - and they're better players than these two, then sure - let 'em go.

    PS - Mike Daniels is the MAN!
     
  11. Southpaw

    Southpaw Endorphin Junkie

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    As far as defensive lineman. Johnny Jolly is a guy we absolutely need to keep on our roster. He's been absolutely instrumental in our ability to stop the run this season. Everytime I watch him play I just shake my head in amazement. Out of the league for 3 years, hooked on the sizzurp, comes back and is basically the best lineman we have.

    I also agree with one of the above posts. Raji doesn't get stats which makes people think he's not doing anything. Nose Tackles have a rather thankless job. It's a very non-glamorous position. If you look at other great Nose Tackles like Vince Wilfork and Kris Jenkins just to name two, they don't really have much more flash or stats than Raji. (For as long as he's been playing anyway.
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2013
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  12. Bagadeez04

    Bagadeez04 Cheesehead

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    Thank you. That is a ton of talent to have to keep in free agency. No where did I suggest I want Raji to go, but a lot of those UFAs are going to have to. The question is which ones?
     
  13. NelsonsLongCatch

    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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    No, for the simple reason that Raji and Daniels do not do the same thing. Raji is a three down defensive lineman who is very good at stopping the run. Daniels is more of a pass rusher. He's shorter and lighter than Raji.
     
  14. NelsonsLongCatch

    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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    Couldn't agree more. Nose Tackles don't have great stats. They do the dirty work that makes the defense work.
     
  15. DevilDon

    DevilDon Inclement Weather Fan

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    Ouch, when you look at that list that way it's alot of talent to see go. But I can trim it a bit for you:
    Take Wilson, Kuhn, Wallace and Francois off the list. I think Pick is gone unless he's going to play for the league minimum. Oh ok, Wallace too.
    I think must-sign players are Raji, Jolly & Shields. Take your pick between Quarless and Finley.
    I hardly think it's going to be a tough decision at all. I believe the market will dictate what happens with the rest.
    Neal, Jones, EDS, Newhouse, Starks will all dictate their prices by how they play the rest of the year. If the Packers win the SB those players will all be premium FAs.
    Would any of them take a "home-town" discount? I guess it will come down to how much of a discount. The Packers have viable backups at all of those positions except EDS. You could argue that he's also one of the more important signings.
     
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  16. ExpatPacker

    ExpatPacker Cheesehead

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    Not re-signing Raji would leave a big hole at NT, and the only reason Packers should let him go is they can't afford him.

    IMO the keepers from this list in order are:

    Sam Shields
    Johnny Jolly
    <J Finley> (depending on his injury)
    BJ Raji
    EDS
    James Jones
    Ryan Pickett
    James Starks
    Andrew Quarless
    Mike Neal

    If we can sign those guys, Packers are in pretty good shape. If we lose Finley, TE might have to be the round 1 or 2 pick. Also a good OC. EDS is adequate, but only adequate. Starks provides a good complement to Lacy at RB. Together, the two of them are a potent combination. Mike Neal keeps getting moved around, but he has improved and I'd hate to give up on him at this stage.
     
  17. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    Raji is probably a priority, Neal is important, Wilson is the Raji failsafe, Jolly should have already gotten his ink as our loyalty will pay off big time, Pickett is a stop gap with only a few years left, Shields had best be top priority, Finley will be interesting, Jones is important but expendable, Kuhn is gone, EDS is our own fault, Quarless is the Finley failsafe, Wallace is gone based purely on Tolzein's pay, Starks is utterly expendable, Francois is expendable but SILB depth is disastrous. Jennings will get an OR Tender, which essentially means nothing.
     
  18. ExpatPacker

    ExpatPacker Cheesehead

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    I'm not certain about Starks' utter expendability. If he can stay healthy (uhhh, ok you got me on that one), he would be valuable spelling Lacy. Getting rid of Kuhn and keeping Lacy, Starks and Franklin sounds pretty good to me.

    I sincerely hope the Packers draft a top prospect at OC so we don't have to rely on EDS anymore. Alternatively, we could wait and see how Tretter's going to do, but that's a risk.

    Also, news has it that the return of Sherrod and Worthy may be delayed until next year's TC because the Packers feel that they have the depth and quality at those positions. I guess that means they're comfortable with Newhouse being the #3 OT and that they have a somewhat higher opinion of him than most of us do. Inarresting.
     
  19. B-ri

    B-ri Cheesehead

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    Let's not forget about DuJuan Harris either. The coaching staff was big on him prior to his injury.
     
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  20. ExpatPacker

    ExpatPacker Cheesehead

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    Ah I forgot about DuJuan. Yes Starks is expendable :)
     
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  21. easyk83

    easyk83 Cheesehead

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    I actually think Raji is the most important on that list. Sure his production hasn't been sexy but he did put the Defense on his back in 2010 and this season he's been an early down bulwark against the run. Without him I don't see us being able to stuff the run with only 2 down linemen like we've been able to this season
     
  22. Poppa San

    Poppa San SB I trophy First of four Staff Member Moderator

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    That ain't gonna happen would be my guess.
    http://www.packersnews.com/article/...d-answer-center-Dietrich-Smith?nclick_check=1
    and

    What gives you the idea Sherrod is out until next year? That decision will be made by Wednesday.
     
  23. DevilDon

    DevilDon Inclement Weather Fan

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    I believe JC is the C of the future or 1st backup at C. He was drafted with that position in mind.
     
  24. PFanCan

    PFanCan That's MISTER Cheesehead, to you.

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    I think James Jones will give GB a significant hometown discount. I mean, look what has happened to Jennings...

    Jones will be back as long as the Packers want him back and are willing to offer something reasonable.
     
  25. HyponGrey

    HyponGrey Caseus Locutus Est

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    Tretter has elite C potential, but as far as I know he has yet to snap a ball. The big problem with drafting a top OC prospect is that this year's C crop is really weak. EDS is a good back up, and could even be good if he wasn't a complete misfit for our system.
     

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