Clifton and Favre

[P@ck66]

ohhhhh I see..Musscy...yeah..i get it now!

I guess the receivers have always "bailed Favre out" over the years...and he really shouldn't be heading to the HALL OF FAME when he retires...because the receivers really "bailed him out" for all those years...

when in reality...he really sucked!

Do i have it right now?

Gee..thanks for clearing that up...!

 

[NDPackerFan]

and what do you think would happen then ND..if Favre threw the ball away..as you suggest...??

Do you think that SherRossley would come up with some brilliant schemes to suprise the other team and get the ball in the end zone?

i sure don't...

and do you think the Pack would have done better this year and be competing for the playoffs now if Favre had done as you suggested, or would it be ALOT of 3 and outs with the most prolific punter in the NFL....BJ Sander...?

I've got news for you...

The season would have been even worse if Favre only threw to the "open receiver" this year.....because the "open receiver" was about as rare as spotting a 12 point..albino buck strolling through downtown GB proper.....(unless of course...you were coming from a downtown GB watering hole...where many such beasts may have been spotted...)

the Pack was "punchless" this year, and the only thing that could have helped them was smart and creative gameplanning by the coaches...

but alas..that happening this year was also as big of a "longshot"...

Well, if Favre was willing to give up on some plays that just aren't there, the defense wouldn't have it's back up against a short field what seems like numerous times a game. Do I like BJ Sander to punt the ball on 3 and outs? Of course not. I do like the fact that even if he puts the ball downfield 38 yards net, the field position is much better than Favre lobbing a hot route to Henderson only to have a LB right there waiting to take it to the house. This game is often about field position which really hurts when the QB refuses to take what's given...

I usually get to Lambeau Field at least once every two years and in the games I've been to, Favre often throws to guys that seem covered while others run free. TV doesn't always show these things...what's amazing to me is how often Favre does fit the ball into tight areas with success.

You know, I hate arguing with you because it seems as though I don't appreciate Favre. It is quite the opposite in fact. He's a future HOF QB and the leader of this team. He can play as long as he has the tools and physically, he still can get it done. The problem is that you cannot admit to anything Favre does as being "suspect" and want to place all blame on coaching, which is ridiculous in my opinion.

 

[P@ck66]

and you can't seem to see that with the current team...the Packer's just cannot score in the red zone...

so it's a moot point...

(i'd like to see a play called at least ONCE that i haven't seen run a million times before to a mediocre result...)

 

[NDPackerFan]

and you can't seem to see that with the current team...the Packer's just cannot score in the red zone...

so it's a moot point...

(i'd like to see a play called at least ONCE that i haven't seen run a million times before to a mediocre result...)

I acknowledge the fact that the Packers cannot score in the red zone. I don't know how it correlates to the statements made earlier about Favre though. In other words, since the offense struggles to score in the red zone, Favre should just heave it up with mediocre playmakers at best into triple coverage? Doesn't seem to make sense. I think a big part of the red zone problems have to do with Clifton forgetting snap counts...happened again last night. Oh, well. I guess the point, as you say, is moot. I'm recognizing that along with other factors that include coaching, Favre is making some very poor decisions and throws because of his frustration level (in my opinion) and you declare that it's only coaching that has put the Packers where they are at. Either way, something needs to improve dramatically in order for the Packers to sniff the playoffs next year.

 

[musccy]

Pack66...start reading posts before you resort back to posting your run-on preconceived notions. I said that the wrs have bailed Brett out of those "wounded duck, whip it up there and see what happens regardless of the coverage, prayers."

As NDpack said, and I've said about 1,000 times WATCH THE RAIDERS MNF GAME!!!!! I find it curious that you NEVER respond to me when I reference this packer game (as one example) and what the wrs did. I presume it's because you're acknowledging that I'm right.

Brett can still step up in the pocket, avoid pressure, and lead a team as well as ever, but his long ball accuracy, decision making, and talent around him to catch those "Brett Favre prayers" is diminishing, and a 15 year future hall of famer needs to realize this and adapt...not continue to be given excuses and free passes just because he tries hard, has a charming smile, has a funny story about his riding lawn mower, and will one day be in the HOF.

 

[tromadz]

Making the playoffs is indeed failing.

careful now, im about to have a lot of fun at your expense, but i like you, so im gonna be nice. Lets just agree...that belicheck is better than sherman. I dont see why we both couldnt at least agree to that one.

all about da packers,

Be careful. One should never question tromadz's expertise nor share an opinion of your own...some people know it all so different views are not needed. All you need to do is just absorb all of the infinite wisdom and you'll be fine. :roll:

so you think making the playoffs is failing too? um, ok. but you got me good! because you did the eye rolling smiley! Wow!

 

[P@ck66]

Hey Musscy,

Didya' ever hear of Lynn Swann and Terry Bradshaw....?

It's called a timing pattern..the receivers are SUPPOSED to go up and get the ball...

and I've got news for you...

THE PACKERS SUCK THIS YEAR AND SO DO THEIR COACHES...!!!

I don't know what you expect to happen...Is SherRossley actually going to pull a new GAMEPLAN out of his *** and magically the PAck will score?

If you know about football..you would be able to see how outmatched the Packer players are in each and every game..and that Brett Favre is the reason why they've at least had a CHANCE of winning some of these games...

But he's only one person...he can't do it all....

(maybe if your ******* beloved coaches could could come up with another play to run that all of us and the whole nfl hasn't seen a million times already..then maybe something else would happen..)

 

[NDPackerFan]

Making the playoffs is indeed failing.

careful now, im about to have a lot of fun at your expense, but i like you, so im gonna be nice. Lets just agree...that belicheck is better than sherman. I dont see why we both couldnt at least agree to that one.

all about da packers,

Be careful. One should never question tromadz's expertise nor share an opinion of your own...some people know it all so different views are not needed. All you need to do is just absorb all of the infinite wisdom and you'll be fine. :roll:

so you think making the playoffs is failing too? um, ok. but you got me good! because you did the eye rolling smiley! Wow!

Actually my comment and eye roll is due to the fact that your self-righteous attitude p*sses a lot of people off. You should have saw all the comments after you left the live chat yesterday. You show up there, call everybody "ridiculously stupid", "morons", type "wrong" to everyone's opinion, and whatever else. The fact of the matter is that you might not know everything there is to know about the GB Packer organization and others may have views that differ from yours! I know you don't think that should be possible, but it might be true.

 

[CaliforniaCheez]

Clifton had 2 false starts that I counted. There have been too many this year.

As to Mr. Favre, the Packers attempted over 50 passes. A poor rushing attack and being behind leads to passing. Pass plays have 3 possible results and 2 are bad.

I did hear the broadcast crew advise before the the game that the Packers/Brett Favre were the only team to get more than 200 yards passing against the Bears this season (1st game). Brett Favre had over 300 yards passing against the Bears on Christmas.

There also has been a failure of the defense to produce turnovers which has led to a large negative turnover ratio.

One of the coaching changes most likely to happen is at QB coach. Both Rodgers and Favre need a top notch one.

 

[vixtalkn]

What decisions would that be ND...and Vix?

P@ck66, you're arguing with NDPackerFan and packedhouse01, not me. I'm with you in this discussion. My point is, you can't just say Favre threw 28 interceptions and for that reason [fill in the blank]. Instead, you need to look at each interception and analyze why it occurred.

For example, packedhouse01 was reasoning that Favre has got to stop throwing into double coverage, but I say, if you go back and look at the picks that occurred in the Bears game, throwing into coverage wasn't the problem at all.

66, I think you adequately argued the fact that, often times, the play sent in gives Favre few options thereby increasing the chances the ball may get picked. And I agree, throwing the ball away everytime he spots a double coverage does nothing more than give us a 3 and out. Might I add my two cents, however.

There is nothing dumb about throwing into double or even triple coverage. The best QBs can do it. In fact, throwing into coverage is what separates the best (including Favre) from the average. IMO, over the years Favre's laser into coverage is what has made Favre, Favre. A QB who has this particular skill and confidence is one half of the winning combination. Match it with a receiver who has the same skill and confidence and, well, you make history.

 

[skibum55]

Can anyone answer this question?

What are the possibilities of SherRossley ever calling a screen pass or delay on the run?

I don't think I've seen one of those in a while. If the D-Line wants to rush -- run a screen pass to slow them down!

Just my "two cents". :shock:

 

[skibum55]

Can anyone answer this question?

What are the possibilities of SherRossley ever calling a screen pass or delay on the run?

I don't think I've seen one of those in a while. If the D-Line wants to rush -- run a screen pass to slow them down!

Just my "two cents". :shock:

 

[musccy]

skibum55...

the reason for the lack of screens has to do w/ the ability of the guards to pull, and delayed draws have been ridiculed pretty heavily by ppl on this board, so I'd be cautious about promoting those on this board

vixtalkn...

For every interception that you can blame on someone else, there's another int that was dropped, was called back due to penalty or whatever. The # of picks you throw is indicative of how you're playing, and 28 picks will not get it done.

and Pack66...

yet again you failed to acknowledge my example of the Raiders MNF game, but I'm used to that. Also, Brett is not the only reason they've had a chance. IN SPITE OF his 5 picks v. Cinncy, the Pack were still in the game...they won in Atl thanks in large part to Samkon...Brett's 4 picks on Sunday sure didn't do them a lot of good. The options are there for Brett, even if it's just some boring check down. It's his choice to pass it to who's open, or try and be the hero.

If you think that you're going to win in the NFL by throwing 28 interceptions, or having Int:TD ratios in games of 4:0, well, then I give you credit for having one heck of an optomistic outlook on life.

 

[P@ck66]

and Musscy..if you think that Sherman and Rossley don't SUCK in face of all the evidence to the contrary..then i want whatever you're smokin'...

and if you think the Packers can score with that motley bunch of nfl europe quality players..then you don't know alot about football...

skibum...

they certainly do use the screen, draw, and shovel pass.... (ad-nauseum).but it has to be at least 3rd and 15 or 20 or more for SherRossley to pull it out...and yes we are sick of seeing it...

what i think you mean is....why don't they throw dump and seam passes to the TE's behind the vacated, blitzing LB's?

and the answer is...

Because they are too stupid to..that is why...

 

[musccy]

So 66...the Packers never run those dump passes you describe? Hmmm, since the TV broadcast ONLY shows the first 3 yards of a receiver's route prior to focusing on the qb, I find it rather curious that you're able to see 5-7 yards down the field to see what sort of routes the players are running.

I also find it interesting how you say in consecutive points that the players suck and can't score, but then blame the coaches for not being productive on offense...and of course Brett gets a free pass for having a crappy surrounding cast...hmmm, seems to be a bit of a contradiction, but I must be wrong since I didn't play 2nd grade recess pick-up football like you, thus don't know any better.

 

[tromadz]

Making the playoffs is indeed failing.

careful now, im about to have a lot of fun at your expense, but i like you, so im gonna be nice. Lets just agree...that belicheck is better than sherman. I dont see why we both couldnt at least agree to that one.

all about da packers,

Be careful. One should never question tromadz's expertise nor share an opinion of your own...some people know it all so different views are not needed. All you need to do is just absorb all of the infinite wisdom and you'll be fine. :roll:

so you think making the playoffs is failing too? um, ok. but you got me good! because you did the eye rolling smiley! Wow!

Actually my comment and eye roll is due to the fact that your self-righteous attitude p*sses a lot of people off. You should have saw all the comments after you left the live chat yesterday. You show up there, call everybody "ridiculously stupid", "morons", type "wrong" to everyone's opinion, and whatever else. The fact of the matter is that you might not know everything there is to know about the GB Packer organization and others may have views that differ from yours! I know you don't think that should be possible, but it might be true.

I dont care that you dont like me and want to attack me, but doing it while helping a "playoffs is failing" argument sure doesn't look too good. And I didnt even say anything mean to about da packers, I went out of my way not to, when it could have been so easy. Relax. I apologize for being irritated at opinions that arent exactly well thought out. Just because someone has an opinion, doesn't mean they can't be right or wrong, so I try to look at all the facts and be on the 'right' side of things. Relax.

Have you been in that chatroom more than 2 weeks? It can be unbearable! Favre throws an incomplete pass and people say he should retire. Gado runs into his own blocker, and people say he stinks. Collins misses a tackle, and all of a sudden he sucks. I mean...cmon. "morons" ... "ridiculously stupid" ...hey...I call em like I see em.

 

[Ryan]

And now we go back to the regularly scheduled topic already in progress...