1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!

    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers. You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
    Dismiss Notice

Clay will be 30 years old before training camp

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by armand34, Mar 28, 2016.

  1. armand34

    armand34 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 24, 2010
    Messages:
    1,920
    Ratings:
    +298
    It's crazy to me that he is already 30 years old. I remember when we traded up to get him like it was just a few years ago. The team is getting older in some integral spots and this draft NEEDS to yield good young stock.

    Anyone want to throw me their top choices that would be available where we are picking?

    I'm very curious.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,523
    Ratings:
    +1,991
    Brady Poppinga on Clay Matthews playing ILB over the past two seasons:
    http://gnb.247sports.com/Bolt/Former-LB-says-Packers-shouldve-never-moved-Matthews-inside-44537412
    I get why Brady says this, but think that he's missing the point. We ALL agree that Matthews is a better OLB than ILB. All things equal he's much more valuable on the end. However, our defense especially against the run was atrocious until they moved Clay inside in 2014. Until that point our defense was losing games for us. The ILB move saved a season for us but it's not ideal and should not be done unless absolutely necessary, which it was at the time.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. ChesterfieldCheesehead

    ChesterfieldCheesehead Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2015
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +12
    It is very crazy he is already going to be 30 I think some of the guys the Pack were getting seemed to be old coming out of college. Jordy is another surprise to me but a interesting thing on Clay is with 7.5 more sacks he will be the franchise career leader in sacks passing KGB according to PFR. He now has 67.5 so hopefully he can continue playing past 30
     
  4. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,722
    Ratings:
    +2,939
    With this potentially being Peppers last year, the time is now to start rebuilding at LB (inside and outside). I'm not so worried about Clay's age and him slowing down, but prefer him on the outside. The problem is, who do we have on the inside, Barrington and Ryan? Both are going to have to improve for the line backing corp to be strong and keep Clay outside. But that still leaves us one injury away from having to move Clay back inside or having Thomas/Palmer step in, none of those guys I am very confident in.

    I see a heavy defensive draft once again, with at least 2 LB's taken high. Hopefully, this time TT can hit on something. With an eye on the future, would love to see the Packers draft Jaylon Smith, the problem is when will he and when should he come off the board?
     
  5. Vrill

    Vrill Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,782
    Ratings:
    +828
    You have to wonder if we are 2-3 years away of going back to the 4-3. Especially when Clay leave or retires.

    But yes, we really need to stack up on DL and LB in this coming draft. I've been saying that since Cook was signed.

    I bet we go mostly all defense in the first 4 rounds (including our two 4th round comp picks) so that would be a total of 6 picks that could potentially go to DL/LB. Maybe 3 each. 3 DL and 3 LB with 1 of those 3 LB's being Jaylon Smith who will likely redshirt.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2016
  6. ChesterfieldCheesehead

    ChesterfieldCheesehead Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2015
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +12
    I agree completely and I'm really ok with it I am perfectly fine with big defensive picks early even the first 3 then I think we can get a couple good prospects in the 4th of lineman then we can go crazy but I think smith is a crazy possibility it would be unreal and a complete steal in my eyes to grab him in the 4th my guess is the 3rd he goes at the latest. I wouldn't throw the remote at the tv if we grab him 3rd either
     
  7. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    12,688
    Ratings:
    +6,640
    If the inside linebacker position isn't addressed early in the draft I have a hard time believing the coaching staff will be able to really move Matthews outside again. I would be excited to draft Jaylon Smith but have no idea either when he should be drafted.

    I agree Thompson better start planning on what to do at outside linebacker after this season as well.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  8. captainWIMM

    captainWIMM Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2012
    Messages:
    12,688
    Ratings:
    +6,640
    There aren't any indications the team is planning to go back to a 4-3 defense at all. With Daniels, Guion and Pennel locks to make the team, Peppers and Jones capable of playing inside in subpackages as well as Ringo and Boyd around I don't see the need to draft three defensive linemen.
     
  9. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,523
    Ratings:
    +1,991
    The team would only go back to a 4-3 when/if Capers is no longer there, a new DC were brought in, and the head coach at the time wanted to make the switch. Obviously it depends on the horses you have at the time as you alluded to Vrill. If the cupboard is bare it's much easier to make the change. If you've got a Clay Matthews in his prime, you don't do that.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    Messages:
    7,801
    Ratings:
    +3,745
    There will be a need by 2017 for an OLB regardless of when Matthews might hit the wall.

    Peppers is year-to-year; Perry and Jones will be FAs after 2016 while not having demonstrated to date that they have the right stuff to take over a 3-down/70% snap role.

    Except for a very few elite rookies, edge rushers require a year of grooming. It's fairly common to see 1st. round edge rushers play they're rookie years in pass down rotation. Then if all goes well he graduates to 3-down play in year 2. It's fairly rare to see an edge-rush rookie walk into the NFL as a well-rounded and productive 3-down player.

    If Peppers hits the wall (or just calls it quits), while Perry and Jones just show what they've shown to date in 2016, all reasonably plausible outcomes, we may be wishing the Packers had gone high in 2016 for an OLB by this time next season.

    That said, it's hard to see how the Packers could go OLB on day 1 of the draft with more immediate needs. And there's always the temptation to wait and see if either Perry or Jones shows enough in 2016 to take over that spot on a 3-down basis. Perry had the late season surge and Jones will be going into his second year at the position. Over recent years, the Packers have shown a fair amount of wishful developmental thinking at positions of current need.

    Day 1 is lining up for D-Line and ILB as the priorities, not necessarily in that order. I think the odds are at least even that we'd see the Packers go OT/G swing man vs. OLB in the 2nd. round, securing a guy they think can graduate to starting OG in 2016. The fact that 4 of the top 6 OLs will be FAs after this season, 2 of them the starting OGs, argues for some action now.

    With OLB there's at least the wishful thinking with Perry and Jones for 2017. The most you can say about the O-Line backups is a projection of Tretter at OG, but he has a lot more value in the league at center in free agency.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2016
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,073
    Ratings:
    +331
    I am praying Jaylon Smith is there in the 2nd and our medical staff has a good feeling on him. I honestly just don't know if his huge ceiling will keep him on the board long enough.
     
  12. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2014
    Messages:
    2,832
    Ratings:
    +1,795
    before they came out and said Jones was moving to OLB, i had DL and OLB as pretty sure bets for our 1st round selection. Maybe even first 2 rounds. With their declaration of his move being permanent, I think the likelihood decreases that OLB is 1st round consideration, but it still wouldn't surprise me.

    Depending on who's available at ILB in the 1st, I could see that being a 3rd round and later pick if that first batch is picked thru already by the time we pick. I am not that high on that Lee guy from OH state though. but i guess my college evaluations are pretty limited.

    From the sounds of it DL and OL are deep, I wouldn't be surprised to see them taken in the first 2 rounds at all, but it depends on who's available
     
  13. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,722
    Ratings:
    +2,939
    Guessing that he will have a medical exam done on the 14th or 15th of April and the results of that will largely determine where he is drafted. If its optimistic news, he may be off the board even before the Packers pick in the first. If its pessimistic, then who knows when. But I bet we hear his name mentioned more then 20 times during the broadcast.
     
  14. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,073
    Ratings:
    +331
    The kid is a beast...honestly if somewhat optimistic and he is there int he 1st I couldn't really hate TT and company for taking the risk and looking to the future...would suck this year, but man his skillset if heals up nicely would be a HUGE upgrade.
     
  15. Pokerbrat2000

    Pokerbrat2000 Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,722
    Ratings:
    +2,939
    Had the Packers addressed their needs at ILB and the D line in Free Agency, I can see taking a chance on Smith in the 1st round (with positive medical news on his future). But they didn't and now it looks like a player that can be relied on to contribute in 2016 at one or both of those positions becomes priority with the first two picks. Unless, TT surprises us and between now and the draft signs someone to fill those needs.
     
  16. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,073
    Ratings:
    +331
    I concur, short term it doesn't make sense, and the predicament we are in needing desperately help at ILB will cause no doubt us to not want to draft him...time will tell.
     
  17. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2012
    Messages:
    7,801
    Ratings:
    +3,745
    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...jaylon-smith-will-miss-all-of-2016-at-minimum

    It's hard to see how there could be sufficient confidence in his eventual recovery by draft day to make him a day one pick. With the injury having occurred on Jan. 1, he'll be only 4 months into his recovery by that time. It would be hard to make a confident projection at that time given the reported severity of the injury.

    Many pundits still have him in or around the 25-50 draft tranche, though I would consider that too high.

    He was undeniably a top 10 talent, and would have been a good fit at Will ILB for the Packers despite his small size. His man coverage ability really pops on the tape. You might need to have a short yardage "caddy" to rotate in for him, but you'd like him for 80% of the snaps. That said, if he was healthy it would be a pipe dream. The Packers would have had to trade 2 first rounders just to get to the #10 pick.

    Regrettably, based on the reports of the severity of the injury, I think round two is too high for the apparent risks involved.
     
  18. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,073
    Ratings:
    +331
    He won't play his first year, and you know that going in. I personally think his skillset is too great to not draft in the 3rd...if someone passes him then they are an idiot. I can understand concern 2nd round or higher.

    Next medical tests are going to be the biggest part of the process on him though.
     
  19. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,523
    Ratings:
    +1,991
    Can you imagine what would happen if TT selected another Justin Harrell type of injured player? The masses would have his head on a platter before mini camps started. That player would have to break Favre's streak in order to avoid the negative comments.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. tynimiller

    tynimiller Cheesehead

    Joined:
    May 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,073
    Ratings:
    +331
    The difference between Harrell and Smith is so polar opposite it is frightening and not worth discussing. Only thing they have in common is an injury....otherwise HUGE talent gap.
     
  21. AmishMafia

    AmishMafia Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    2,975
    Ratings:
    +2,226
    Im guessing you have never seen Harrell play.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2016
  22. Mondio

    Mondio Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2014
    Messages:
    2,832
    Ratings:
    +1,795
    Harrell had talent, and was coming out of college with a torn bicep, but he was really pretty good in college. he never had a chance to show anything in the pro's though. Came into the league recovering from an injury, I think he had back surgery or more in the next year or 2 and then blew out his knee. Lots of bad luck with that guy. Felt bad for him, because he did what he had to do in college to make it to the next level, and he had the physical attributes to be good. But lots of things keep people from being good in the pros. maybe he just wasn't, but the injuries never let us know for sure.
     
  23. Vrill

    Vrill Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,782
    Ratings:
    +828
    Jaylon Smith is one of those perceived "difference makers" that can actually make a difference and make an NFL defense better starting on day 1. But when day 1 is, is anyone's best guess. I will say that his stock will be late 1st, early/mid 2nd if there is any chance at all of him actually playing in 2016. However, if he is out for the year, then he could very well be there when we pick in round 2. So if we want Jaylon, we'll have to draft him in the 2nd round. He wont be there when we pick in round 3 regardless of his status because his talent will be too enticing to pass up for some team. I see NE, Dallas, Seattle, SF, Arizona or someone like that drafting him before we pick in round 3.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  24. sdh09e44

    sdh09e44 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2015
    Messages:
    68
    Ratings:
    +11
    agree it will be a Defensive heavy draft, but TT will grab an OL with one of those picks. Maybe even the 2nd rounder, but im hoping he waits to get one with one of the three comp picks we have in the 4th.
     
  25. sdh09e44

    sdh09e44 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2015
    Messages:
    68
    Ratings:
    +11
    and that's the best thing about the Cook signing I think. That we are now able to not spend a pick on this weak TE class in the early rounds.

    TT is bound to hit with at least 1 or 2 of the 5 or 6 picks that will be spent on Defense. Clinton-dix, randall, and this next guy are gonna be the long term cornerstones of the Defense. We need to hit gold just once more.....
     

Share This Page