Clay Mathews is done.

[Mondio]

PED's and injuries aside, he's a 32 year old football player with 9 years of football on his body. Those things might play a role, but I think the explanation for the trend in his play is pretty simple.

I'm sure it is, just adding some insight on the other potential issue

 

[Heyjoe4]

Packers could easily have gotten Mack. They just refused to give up those first round picks tho. You could have extended him by not bringing back Matthews or HAHA next season which i would’ve been fine with.

Agreed. Actually I would have given up the first two rounders and CMIII and HHCD. Initially I thought it would take Cobb to be thrown in, and that might have been tried. Again, the past is past, but I agree with you. If Glute had wanted to make it happen, it would have happened. The price would have been steep, but IMO, we have an entire LB corp or “just guys”. Is that enough to win a SB if the DL, DBs and Safeties play well? Maybe. But look at the great Ds. They all have pass rushing ability, beyond “just guys”. Disappointing, but those are the cards we have

On a different topic, I was upset that MM didn’t have the team prepared for the game. They looked mostly like zombies out there in the first half. Yeah, the players need to motivate themselves as well, so it’s not all on MM. This isn’t the first time I’ve seen this happen. I just think MM lacks that ability. Others can disagree and that’s ok. Bellicek is pretty stoic on the sideline as well (ok, that’s an understatement). MM has been carried by Favre and ARod for too long.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

PED's and injuries aside, he's a 32 year old football player with 9 years of football on his body. Those things might play a role, but I think the explanation for the trend in his play is pretty simple.

I realize it could be age related, but there are a lot of players that don't start having that kind of drop in play at the age of 30, which is when we saw Clay begin his slide.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I mean all you have to do is watch the game, bro. I wouldn’t call it BS if it’s true. He literally gave up 5 or 6 big runs to his side. He didn’t do really anything as a pass rusher either. The roughing penalty was stupid as he had about two steps to veer off yet he continued to follow through smh. OLB, OL, and safety are definitely NEEDS. I’m positive at least two of those positions are addressed early in the draft next season. There is NO reason to extend him after this season.

Most of the critique of CMIII here is justified. Hindsight is 20/20, but the dude just played terribly, and then took out his anger at the worst time. He has been reduced to trying to run around linemen where he used to run through them. He has nothing to be ashamed about, he’s getting older. Edge rusher is a young man’s game. By the time a guy turns 30, it’s almost inevitable that he’ll slow down. All that said, we gotta play this year with what we got. But I won’t be surprised to see CMIII gone next year. He gave us a lot, made a huge play in the SB win over the Steelers - 8 years ago. Gluten addressed a LOT of problems but he couldn’t solve em all in one year. Next year you can be sure he loads up on edge players and O lineman. Considering last year, it’s still a big improvement. But last night’s victory was all ARod. He needs more help.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Move him back inside. Less of a liability there given that outside he breaks contain regularly and gets turned around now. Watching him tonight, I counted 4 plays he gave up on the play, then on 2 of them it swung back his direction and he was out of the play.
Old clay always motored and found the play.
This clay watched.

Best suggestion I’ve seen here, and maybe the only positive one. CMIII will be more effective inside. His edge days are, I’m afraid, over.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

People might disagree with me here, but yes, the hit on Trubisky was a penalty under today's rules, but not as flagrant and stupid as people are painting it out to be. That would have been a tough one for Clay to pull up on, but seems that part doesn't matter anymore with some of the other ones I have seen called in the last month + Protect those QB's at all costs and the latest "Rogers Rule" I believe has refs twitching even more to throw that flag.

 

[Mondio]

Most of the critique of CMIII here is just... But last night’s victory was all ARod. He needs more help.

It wasn't. His heroics were great, no need to diminish them to make another point, but that win wasn't all him. We can critique clay all day, and everything else. Much is warranted, but the defense gave up what? 16 points? You should win NFL games if you're only giving up 16 points with today's rules. Adams had some great catches and runs. GMo had a great catch and made some big plays. So did Cobb. And for as bad as our oline was in the first half, they kept an immobile QB upright for the most part in the 2nd. There was a lot more to that win than just Rodgers.

 

[Mondio]

People might disagree with me here, but yes, the hit on Trubisky was a penalty under today's rules, but not as flagrant and stupid as people are painting it out to be. That would have been a tough one for Clay to pull up on, but seems that part doesn't matter anymore with some of the other ones I have seen called in the last month + Protect those QB's at all costs and the latest "Rogers Rule" I believe has refs twitching even more to throw that flag.

I think the biggest part from the back it looked like he lowered his head and went high. I get you can't pull up, but you can shove them in the back too. He went high and to deliver a blow. IMO contact can't be avoided at times, but there also isn't a need to do anymore than make contact. Clay gave him some extra even though the ball was gone

 

[GleefulGary]

People might disagree with me here, but yes, the hit on Trubisky was a penalty under today's rules, but not as flagrant and stupid as people are painting it out to be. That would have been a tough one for Clay to pull up on, but seems that part doesn't matter anymore with some of the other ones I have seen called in the last month + Protect those QB's at all costs and the latest "Rogers Rule" I believe has refs twitching even more to throw that flag.

He was:
1) Late
2) High
3) Left his feet

That’s a roughing call for the past decade at least. It was an awful play, and incredibly stupid from a veteran player.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

He was:
1) Late
2) High
3) Left his feet

That’s a roughing call for the past decade at least. It was an awful play, and incredibly stupid from a veteran player.

Yet Barr wasn't flagged for a similar hit on Rodgers last year that broke his collar bone. Again, I am not debating the call, all I am saying is that it wasn't as flagrant or quite as bone headed as some are making it out to be. Costly? Yes, nearly cost us the game.

 

[GleefulGary]

Yet Barr wasn't flagged for a similar hit on Rodgers last year that broke his collar bone. Again, I am not debating the call, all I am saying is that it wasn't as flagrant or quite as bone headed as some are making it out to be. Costly? Yes, nearly cost us the game.

Similar? I don’t see how.

Barr never left his feet and he didn’t go high, he just pile drived him. And Barr’s hit shouldn’t have been penalized.

Clay’s hit was clearly against any rule we’ve had for the past decade.

 

[Dantés]

This....actually might be what separates Pettine from Capers. Too often we saw the opposite out of Capers. Teams would figure out Capers defense and shred it and Dom would have no answers. Meanwhile Pettine watches closely, doesn't panic and says "ok, here is what we are going to do to stop them." Whether it was completely the Packer defense stopping the Bears or the Bears stopping themselves, that second half was what was needed to happen and Pettine had a big role in it. Now imagine if we had that same second half defense with a pass rush

If I am a Bear fan today, I am really questioning Nagy on that eventual FG drive and his not wanting to just hammer the ball on the ground on 3rd and 1, instead a pass play deep is incomplete and the clock stops as well. A first down there and the Packers are really on the ropes.

But I am sure if he calls a run play and its stuffed, Bear fans scream he is too conservative. I guess there is no winning when it comes to losing.

We will see how things continue to unfold with Pettine. Perhaps he won't always adjust so well. Or perhaps (more hopefully) when he goes into a game with good tape on a coach/system, he won't need as much adjustment.

It's a cliche (a true one) to say this is a copy-cat league. But teams can't copy success, only means to attain success. All offseason, we've heard about how Nagy is McVay 2.0 and will revamp the Bears' offense the same way the former revamped the Rams. But that makes some big assumptions-- e.g. that Nagy is as good/creative a coach, that Trubisky will be able to be good enough to make it work, that their offseason acquisitions will actually fit, and even that McVay himself is due to be more than a flash in the pan. I've not bought in to their offense taking that kind of leap because I've just never believed in Trubisky.

 

[Dantés]

I realize it could be age related, but there are a lot of players that don't start having that kind of drop in play at the age of 30, which is when we saw Clay begin his slide.

I haven't studied this, but anecdotally I would say that players who maintain a high level of play into their 30's are more exception than rule. And to be fair, Clay slid at around age 30 but he has still been a very useful starter for those two seasons-- just not what he once was.

 

[gbgary]

had a poor game for sure...AND perhaps the most bone-headed play of his career. pff gave him a 29 grade. yikes! hopefully an aberration. if not a benching will be in his future...maybe even a cut.

 

[rodell330]

Packers made a mistake not getting Mack plain and simple. If the Raiders wanted those two first rd picks you give them up! Mack is a proven Superstar who on a “pitch count” destroyed us in the first half...Being out of shape. If anything you get the guy to keep him away from a division rival! We could’ve had the best offensive player and defensive player in the NFC on the same damn team. You overpay for edge rushers, Qb’s and tackles. Especially if they are elite. Idc about the money, the Packers could’ve made it work. They screwed this one up. Every time we see Mack this will be a topic I’m sure. Especially since we don’t have a single elite pass rusher .

 

[Dantés]

Packers made a mistake not getting Mack plain and simple. If the Raiders wanted those two first rd picks you give them up! Mack is a proven Superstar who on a “pitch count” destroyed us in the first half...Being out of shape. If anything you get the guy to keep him away from a division rival! We could’ve had the best offensive player and defensive player in the NFC on the same damn team. You overpay for edge rushers, Qb’s and tackles. Especially if they are elite. Idc about the money, the Packers could’ve made it work. They screwed this one up. Every time we see Mack this will be a topic I’m sure. Especially since we don’t have a single elite pass rusher .

I have no problem with anyone holding the opinion that the Packers should have done what it took to acquire Mack, but it is anything but "plain and simple." The combination of draft capital and cap space, balanced with Rodgers' contract and the need for starters on rookie contracts made it a highly complex proposition. They went after him. They were unwilling to pay what it would have taken to top the Bears' offer (I am convinced that they would have had to offer more than the Bears, as the Raiders clearly think that the Bears' picks will be higher). The Bears were able to afford him easily because they have a cheap QB on a rookie deal. Who, by the way, cost them the game with his ineffectiveness despite how great Mack was in the first half. We won't be able to have a good discussion about whether or not it was a mistake until after we see what Gutekunst does with the picks and cap space over the next couple years. If he hits on both 1st round picks and signs a couple good starters, it will be hard to say that it was a mistake not to spend it all on Mack.

 

[Starr To Dowler]

He's at an age where the final dropoff from useful to no longer useful could be abrupt. There's a chance that his terrible outing last night is the first sign that he is, in fact, "done." But it's also possible that he had a terrible game and he's a useful player for the rest of the season. Week one observations should always be accompanied by a "wait and see" mentality.

At his position, where speed, raw power, and explosiveness are essential, losing just a half step can be everything. And you're right, once you get past around 30 or so, it can be like hitting a wall. We've all seen stories of veteran players who had a sort of an off year, but didn't worry too much about it, and then came back after just a few months of an offseason to find that it was just gone - just like that. Not saying that's what's happening to Clay, but he sure wouldn't be the first. If that ain't it, it's up to him to prove that.

 

[rodell330]

I have no problem with anyone holding the opinion that the Packers should have done what it took to acquire Mack, but it is anything but "plain and simple." The combination of draft capital and cap space, balanced with Rodgers' contract and the need for starters on rookie contracts made it a highly complex proposition. They went after him. They were unwilling to pay what it would have taken to top the Bears' offer (I am convinced that they would have had to offer more than the Bears, as the Raiders clearly think that the Bears' picks will be higher). The Bears were able to afford him easily because they have a cheap QB on a rookie deal. Who, by the way, cost them the game with his ineffectiveness despite how great Mack was in the first half. We won't be able to have a good discussion about whether or not it was a mistake until after we see what Gutekunst does with the picks and cap space over the next couple years. If he hits on both 1st round picks and signs a couple good starters, it will be hard to say that it was a mistake not to spend it all on Mack.

I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I think Jackson and Alexander were two excellent picks. But you can’t pass on elite pass rushers. As I mentioned cut ties with Bulaga, Mathews, and Haha after the season and there’s your cap space.

 

[Dantés]

I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt because I think Jackson and Alexander were two excellent picks. But you can’t pass on elite pass rushers. As I mentioned cut ties with Bulaga, Mathews, and Haha after the season and there’s your cap space.

I think it's reasonable to skeptically wait and see what Gutekunst now does with those resources. I was really, really eager for them to land Mack. I started a thread about it way back on August 1st. But I was also of the opinion that if it was going to cost two 1st round picks and a 24M$/season contract, I was out. Everyone is going to have a different tipping point, and it's partly arbitrary, but that was my opinion. Hindsight, I think it would have take both 1st rounders and then some. Or at least both 1st rounders and no 2nd coming back like the Bears got. But that's my speculation. I can't prove it.

 

[906Fan]

Watching Reggie Gilbert cover that guy to the end zone makes me think we have a bigger faster replacement ready for Old man Matthews.

 

[rodell330]

I think it's reasonable to skeptically wait and see what Gutekunst now does with those resources. I was really, really eager for them to land Mack. I started a thread about it way back on August 1st. But I was also of the opinion that if it was going to cost two 1st round picks and a 24M$/season contract, I was out. Everyone is going to have a different tipping point, and it's partly arbitrary, but that was my opinion. Hindsight, I think it would have take both 1st rounders and then some. Or at least both 1st rounders and no 2nd coming back like the Bears got. But that's my speculation. I can't prove it.

I’m hearing only the 2 first rounders would’ve sufficed. The Bears couldn’t have offered more than us I’m sure.

 

[rodell330]

Watching Reggie Gilbert cover that guy to the end zone makes me think we have a bigger faster replacement ready for Old man Matthews.

Yea that was a great play by Gilbert because that was 6. Maybe he starts to see more time. Put Matthews in the middle

 

[Dantés]

I’m hearing only the 2 first rounders would’ve sufficed. The Bears couldn’t have offered more than us I’m sure.

That's the thing-- it comes down to what we're hearing. The chatter I heard after the fact all suggested that the Packers would have needed to offer more than the Bears because the Raiders believe that Chicago picks will continue to be much higher than Green Bay picks. The Bears offered two 1st rounders and got back a 2nd; I think the Packers would have needed to do both 1st rounders plus or both 1st rounders and no pick coming back. You would have preferred that and I get it. I wouldn't have.

 

[AmishMafia]

had a poor game for sure...AND perhaps the most bone-headed play of his career. pff gave him a 29 grade. yikes! hopefully an aberration. if not a benching will be in his future...maybe even a cut.

For context, PFF rated 74 OLBs and Matthews ranked 74th. Said, (i'm not sure if this was a joke) that only 1 player was rated lower - Nathan Peterman QB. Who had one of the worsts game of any QB in NFL history.

 

[OldSchool101]

If we had lost this game due to his boneheaded play there would be riots calling for his head. I am surprised he wasnt ejected for his head hit to Trubusky.

Agreed. While coming from a different angle. That hit was reminiscent of Anthony Barr. He also saw the QB throw but, IMO out of frustration, took two more strides before laying into him.
Except Clay went for the head Jesse Ventura Style.. whereas Barr went for the WWF Style bodyslam knockout in Andre the Giant fashion.
Clays was bordering on an ejection with the new rules.