Can we declare 2013 a Failed Draft Class?

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,078
Reaction score
7,894
Location
Madison, WI
One of the premises of the "Draft and Develop" concept that Ted Thompson uses is that you draft guys, develop them and resign them, keeping them on your team for that second contract. Looking back now at the "Class of 2013", even with 11 draft picks that year, something didn't work out well for TT and the Packers.

Packers 2013 draft class

DE Datone Jones (Signed with the Vikings)
RB Eddie Lacy (Signed with the Seahawks)
LT David Bakhtiari
OL JC Tretter (Signed with the Browns)
RB Johnathan Franklin (Forced to retire due to injury)
DB Micah Hyde (Signed with the Bills)
DE Josh Boyd (Released in 2016)
LB Nate Palmer (Released in 2016)
WR Charles Johnson (Signed by the Browns in 2013)
WR Kevin Dorsey (Released in 2015)
LB Sam Barrington (Released in 2016)

How have other draft classes fared and still on the team?

2012 draft class: Perry and Daniels
2011: Randall Cobb, Davon House (returns)
2010: Bulaga and Burnett
2009: Matthews
2008: Nelson
2007: Crosby
2006:
2005: Rodgers

How will 2014-16 draft classes fare? It is starting to feel like the Packers have turned into "Draft and Pray" that the young guys can give a few solid vets the support that they need.

Maybe we can start calling TT's model: "Draft. Develop. Replace"
 
Last edited:

Spanky

Cheesehead
Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
623
Reaction score
392
Any draft class that includes one of the best LT's in football cannot be considered a "failure."
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
went thru this on another thread. remove 2, 3 if you count boyd and his destroyed ankle. Then you have 4? that were coveted enough to be week 1 signings in FA. and then our Franchise left tackle.

Yes, it's too bad we couldn't have kept a couple of those guys. It would have been worse had we overpaid to do so, but clearly enough guys fully worthy and capable of being players in the NFL were selected a few seasons ago.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,078
Reaction score
7,894
Location
Madison, WI
went thru this on another thread. remove 2, 3 if you count boyd and his destroyed ankle. Then you have 4? that were coveted enough to be week 1 signings in FA. and then our Franchise left tackle.

Yes, it's too bad we couldn't have kept a couple of those guys. It would have been worse had we overpaid to do so, but clearly enough guys fully worthy and capable of being players in the NFL were selected a few seasons ago.

I'm not really questioning the draft talent, although that could be debated, I am looking more at the bigger picture on the principle that TT has built this team on; "Draft, develop and resign". We have 1 player from an 11 player draft class, hard to declare that a successful draft when using the DDRS principle.
 

Spanky

Cheesehead
Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
623
Reaction score
392
We have 1 player from an 11 player draft class, hard to declare that a successful draft when using the DDRS principle.

Getting 1 impact player with several others being productive in their first contract with GB can be considered a success. I'm not by any means saying 2013 was a great draft class, but it certainly wasn't a failure.
 

RepStar15

"We're going to relentlessly chase perfection."
Joined
Feb 4, 2015
Messages
1,461
Reaction score
265
Location
Cranston, RI
I would not call Lacey a failure. Its not our fault he got fat! And Bakhtiari is probably the second best player on our football team. I LOVED JC Tretter and Micah Hyde (who could honestly end up back in GB because he is not the player Buffalo wants him to be). But yes, the rest is trash. Maybe with Ted Thompson actually engaging in FA this year, someone else will be putting together the draft board.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
I'm not really questioning the draft talent, although that could be debated, I am looking more at the bigger picture on the principle that TT has built this team on; "Draft, develop and resign". We have 1 player from an 11 player draft class, hard to declare that a successful draft when using the DDRS principle.
what are YOU shooting for? re-signing 11? 4? 2? if so, which ones and for how much? better to overpay for non play makers? or let them go? How much cap do we dedicate to them? Let's face it, they played well enough to get a rather nice FA contract from other teams, and didn't play well enough to invest future cap and bigger dollars in by the people that know them best.

It happens. I wouldn't call it a failure either. Unfortunate, but failure? how does picking a franchise LT, 4 other week 1 Free Agents, a couple players and a couple lost to injury qualify as a failure?
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,078
Reaction score
7,894
Location
Madison, WI
Getting 1 impact player with several others being productive in their first contract with GB can be considered a success. I'm not by any means saying 2013 was a great draft class, but it certainly wasn't a failure.

Project those numbers forward, 1 impact player from every draft class (after 4 years), that doesn't impress me that much. Not to mention 1 player.....one of eleven is still with the team. As far as any of the other 10 players being "productive", I would agree on Hyde and Lacy.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,078
Reaction score
7,894
Location
Madison, WI
Again, for those who don't understand what I am saying here, I am not asking "Did TT pick 11 good players in the 2013 draft class? let's rate them". I am merely pointing out that a GM that prides himself on Draft and Develop is going to have to do better than having 1 guy (out of 11) still on the team after 4 year, or he is going to have to find other ways to find talent.
 
Last edited:

C-Lee

Cheesehead
Joined
Oct 9, 2015
Messages
2,144
Reaction score
420
Datone being the 1st round pick makes this list look so bad.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
do you think the Packers won't fill out a complete roster this year? do you think we should have outbid the Patriots for Gilmore? you think one of these other guys left is the answer? i know exactly what you're trying to say. You want to complain that ted hasn't picked up more FA's. Well, who, how much, put your name to it. Now and see where it goes. Let us examine how it might affect us going forward too.

None off the guys that are gone, were worth investing big dollars in or even the dollars they go elsewhere. I don't see great replacements for them available at this exact moment either. There are camp cuts and the draft yet and 5 months till anyone has to sweat anything.

He could have kept 5 guys on this roster, but then you'd be complaining he spent too much on them rather than signing someone else that doesn't even seem to be readilly available. or worthy of a big investment either.
 

PackerDNA

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
6,428
Reaction score
1,499
what are YOU shooting for? re-signing 11? 4? 2? if so, which ones and for how much? better to overpay for non play makers? or let them go? How much cap do we dedicate to them? Let's face it, they played well enough to get a rather nice FA contract from other teams, and didn't play well enough to invest future cap and bigger dollars in by the people that know them best.

It happens. I wouldn't call it a failure either. Unfortunate, but failure? how does picking a franchise LT, 4 other week 1 Free Agents, a couple players and a couple lost to injury qualify as a failure?

So you're defending TT by saying he was wise to let non impact players go rather than waste cap dollars on them.
Wasn't TT the guy who drafted them in the first place?
 

PackerDNA

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
6,428
Reaction score
1,499
do you think the Packers won't fill out a complete roster this year? do you think we should have outbid the Patriots for Gilmore? you think one of these other guys left is the answer? i know exactly what you're trying to say. You want to complain that ted hasn't picked up more FA's. Well, who, how much, put your name to it. Now and see where it goes. Let us examine how it might affect us going forward too.

None off the guys that are gone, were worth investing big dollars in or even the dollars they go elsewhere. I don't see great replacements for them available at this exact moment either. There are camp cuts and the draft yet and 5 months till anyone has to sweat anything.

He could have kept 5 guys on this roster, but then you'd be complaining he spent too much on them rather than signing someone else that doesn't even seem to be readilly available. or worthy of a big investment either.

Same weak crap we hear every year at this time from the defenders of TT. This makes 13 years of it.
How do we know he won't do enough- if anything- in the next 5 months?
See the first 12 years.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
So you're defending TT by saying he was wise to let non impact players go rather than waste cap dollars on them.
Wasn't TT the guy who drafted them in the first place?
no, i'm saying at least half his draft class not lost to injury are obviously very capable and also wanted by more than just Ted, to play in this league. A few teams paid some nice contracts to get them away. and your stance is because they aren't all pro bowlers it's a failed draft?
 

Pkrjones

Cheesehead
Joined
Jul 3, 2014
Messages
3,803
Reaction score
1,725
Location
Northern IL
At least 1/2 of the 2013 GB draft is still in the league so I don't consider it a failure. When the top-paid 8 players on the team are using-up more then 1/2 of the available cap there isn't $$ to hang-onto quality, non-star players after their first contract.
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
Same weak crap we hear every year at this time from the defenders of TT. This makes 13 years of it.
How do we know he won't do enough- if anything- in the next 5 months?
See the first 12 years.
more success than 30 other teams in the league out of 32. Not too bad. I think we'll be in the mix again
 

Mondio

Cheesehead
Joined
Dec 20, 2014
Messages
15,893
Reaction score
3,795
Same weak crap we hear every year at this time from the defenders of TT. This makes 13 years of it.
How do we know he won't do enough- if anything- in the next 5 months?
See the first 12 years.
ok, enough with the weak crap. Put your names and your dollars out there right now. Put your name to it. Every year we hear about the Rolondo mclain's, the Jarius Byrds, the Myles Jack's the eryone else we "should sign" and almost always a year later everyone is drowning out there past completely failed projections with their new ones that are likely destined for the same.
 

PackerDNA

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
6,428
Reaction score
1,499
no, i'm saying at least half his draft class not lost to injury are obviously very capable and also wanted by more than just Ted, to play in this league. A few teams paid some nice contracts to get them away. and your stance is because they aren't all pro bowlers it's a failed draft?

I'm sorry did I say that? Why, no- that was you. Enough with the injury stuff; this guy disgusts me anymore, and I'm done with him. This team will never get to another SB while he's running the show, because he's a part time GM who refuses to do his job fully.
 
OP
OP
Pokerbrat2000

Pokerbrat2000

Opinions are like A-holes, we all have one.
Joined
Oct 30, 2012
Messages
32,078
Reaction score
7,894
Location
Madison, WI
no, i'm saying at least half his draft class not lost to injury are obviously very capable and also wanted by more than just Ted, to play in this league. A few teams paid some nice contracts to get them away. and your stance is because they aren't all pro bowlers it's a failed draft?

How do you defend a 4 year old draft class of 11 players that has one guy still on the team and then you state "None off the guys that are gone, were worth investing big dollars in or even the dollars they go elsewhere.?"
 

PackerDNA

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
6,428
Reaction score
1,499
ok, enough with the weak crap. Put your names and your dollars out there right now. Put your name to it. Every year we hear about the Rolondo mclain's, the Jarius Byrds, the Myles Jack's the eryone else we "should sign" and almost always a year later everyone is drowning out there past completely failed projections with their new ones that are likely destined for the same.


It is weak crap; the same weak crap we've been getting from this guy for 13 years now, followed by the same tired defenses of it.
Name and dollars? There's the other half of it. The same straw man. If we-I- wanted to waste the next several hours or days researching a list , we'd find that you actually can have success at the FA game- if you wisely participate in it (emphasize on 'participate'). But you cherry pick a few examples and think that's the end of it.
The thing that cracks me up, Mondio, is that we actually agree on that; you and a few others here just rabidly jump to the defense of the beloved TT. I wonder if you're actually Packer fans , or TT fans first and above all.
 

PackerDNA

Cheesehead
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
6,428
Reaction score
1,499
more success than 30 other teams in the league out of 32. Not too bad. I think we'll be in the mix again

All losers. Glorified losers doesn't make it special. Or any better. Look at the Patriots so far this off season, then look at how they've set themselves up from here on out through the draft. Lot of planning, lots of action, lots of aggression.
This guy? Same do the minimum, do the same things. and for God's sake , do it cheap and don't risk precious comp picks. He has no more of a plan then his team has an identity. It's all lateral moves to fill holes. Holes often created by he himself. We're treading water again; from this season on- as long as Ted is here- we'll start to sink.
 

AmishMafia

Cheesehead
Joined
Sep 27, 2010
Messages
7,279
Reaction score
2,395
Location
PENDING
How do you defend a 4 year old draft class of 11 players that has one guy still on the team and then you state "None off the guys that are gone, were worth investing big dollars in or even the dollars they go elsewhere.?"
Classic!

The anti TT ilk is now complaining that we dont sign our own FAs after he brings in 3 FAs in the first few days of free agency.

4 of the players drafted were sought by other teams and are clearly above average football players. We did not resign them for reasons other than they were poor players. They were not resigned because we have cheaper talent on the bench to replace them; limited by cap space because of even more drafted talent is taking up the cap; or another NFL team nust values them substantially more than the Packers.

Either of those 3 possibilities is actually a positive when evaluating TT. How you can hold TT accountable for other teams raiding our talent is disingenuous.
 

Members online

Latest posts

Top