1. Welcome to Green Bay Packers NFL Football Forum & Community!

    Packer Forum is one of the largest online communities for the Green Bay Packers. You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Sign Up or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
    Dismiss Notice

Bad one week...Good next week

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by abztractmynd, Dec 11, 2006.

  1. abztractmynd

    abztractmynd Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2006
    Messages:
    272
    Ratings:
    +0
    OK ladies and gentlemen...Brett Favre had a great game today, granted it was against a team without any serious shutdown defensive backs. I see people saying Favre is back, cheering and getting very excited. All that is great for fan moral, but is he really back to what he used to be?

    No...he is back to what he was 2 yrs ago. He can beat bad teams with the best of them thats for sure! But there is no hope when it comes to beating a great team, or even a moderate playoff contender. Lets review...

    This year the Packers have only played 6 teams out of 16 with a winning record. Out of those 6 teams, the packers have beat...you guessed it: none of those teams. In those 6 losses the only good game Favre had was against the Saints.

    Have injuries to Favre really been the cause of his bad play the last 3 weeks? Or is the reason he has been playing bad those last 3 weeks because the Packers were playing dominant teams?

    Think about it....good team: poor play, lost ( combined record of 50-27 ) bad team: pro bowl status, win ( combined record of 23-42 )

    Come on people...he's not back, and u know it. :bs:
     
  2. all about da packers

    all about da packers Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    7,033
    Ratings:
    +0
    This man is 37 years old.

    If you expect him to beat the good teams all alone, make medicore WRs into HOF type players, and come up with plays that amaze you on every down then you aren't being realistic.

    At 37 years old, he isn't anywhere near his prime or even early 30s. He isn't as mobile, he isn't as accurate, and he MAY not be as strong in the arm. With that said, he is stilll in the top 10 at the QB position in this league.

    When he had Walker, you saw the damage he could do. How many QBs can come back in with a concussion, and get a TD on a 4th and long play? Not many.

    Look, McCarthy hasn't stuck to the run, and has Brett throwing the MOST OUT OF ANY QB CURRENTLY IN THE NFL. At 37 years of age, you are bound to run into problems when you ask a guy who is nearing the end to go and get out of trouble with talent that would be competitive at NFL Euro level.

    The real method to judge how Brett has done is to look at how other QBs would have done in the situation. Could Brady and Manning have done better? Perhaps. How much better? 1 win tops. There is hardly any talent on this roster, no consistent run support, and terrible D that surely impacts the pressure the O feels to score.

    Brett is STILL the best chance the Packers have at winning the game. Go back to his numbers before the groin pull a few weeks back. He was just fine where he was.

    I ask you, how can a player go from "Solid" to "God Awful" in a (bye) weeks time? The only answer is that he was having some serious injury problems.

    As for your loosing to all good teams analogy, um last time I checked IT WAS A TEAM GAME. Brett is made to run out of the pocket and he has no TE or Hb or FB to throw to at times because they are too busy protecting the young o-line. Not even Mike Vick can beat all the good teams by himself, he needs help. The losses to the good teams aren't a total reflection of Brett, rather it's a total reflection of the lack of depth and talent the Packers have to compete with Superbowl contenders.

    Brett just needs to do what he can; be the leader this team needs and go out and give the WRs a shot to make catches. He did it for the major part of his carrer, did it for the first half of this season, and did it today. Evidence suggests he never left.
     
  3. Yared-Yam

    Yared-Yam Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    1,120
    Ratings:
    +0
    I would've considered Minnesota a "moderate playoff contender."

    He also played well in a loss to the Rams.

    We lose to good teams and beat the bad ones. Sounds like a recipe for a young team.

    Next year is looking kinda decent.
     
  4. all about da packers

    all about da packers Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    7,033
    Ratings:
    +0
    BTW - abztract who are you to really come in here and say "he's not back and you know it"? Unless you've got a mind reading ability, you sure as hell better not be telling people what they really 'think'.

    And as for the "BS" comment, if you don't like what you read, then don't read it. People aren't going to agree with you princess, so grow up and learn to respect the right of people to post their opinion without having it be called BS. If you don't like them and think they are so wrong and can't at least learn to respect their right to post their opinion, I'm sure you can find some other place to post that will agree with your views entirely.
     
  5. vikesrule

    vikesrule Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2006
    Messages:
    1,933
    Ratings:
    +0
    ^^^ First time I've seen you pissed off aadp. :thumbsup:
     
  6. Zero2Cool

    Zero2Cool I own a website

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2004
    Messages:
    11,903
    Ratings:
    +8

    That's because he doesn't post after me ;)
     
  7. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Messages:
    17,837
    Ratings:
    +3,484
    :agree:

    But wasnt Frisco also in the playoff hunt? Did they not have a 3game winning streak? did they not beat the Seahawks?
     
  8. P@ck66

    P@ck66 Banned Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2005
    Messages:
    2,207
    Ratings:
    +0
    Gee..and I thought football was a "team sport".....

    I guess Brett Favre is the only one out there on the field though since certain obsessed posters want to lay all the blame at his feet all the time.... :whippin:

    Silly effin' me...i guess.
     
  9. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    hahha..I love it when non bay area people call this city "FRISCO"....

    GB played great...

    Alex Smith sucks..pretty bad. He ain't worth 60 million.
    That team is only good because of fumbler Frank Gore.
     
  10. dhpackr

    dhpackr Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2005
    Messages:
    1,635
    Ratings:
    +0
    Far as I'm concerned, Brett's hasn't lost anything. I don't blame #4 for any loss.
     
  11. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2005
    Messages:
    1,922
    Ratings:
    +38
    ...and if Bf hadn't of been the QB two years ago we would have lost more games to losing teams than we did. He pulled us out of games when our rotten "D" didn't show up so often it wasn't funny.

    Our three game losing streak to decent teams was again highlighted by a defense that didn't show up for 10 of 12 quarters. Peyton Manning (see Sunday) can't pull a team out that plays defense THAT BADLY.

    To see BF standing in a tightining pocket and hitting Driver 40 yards down field throwing it off his back foot is something most fans in most stadiums seldom witness. Probably a sight we won't see for years to come when he's gone.

    Let the "0" line get some experience and give Favre a couple more legitimate NFL WR's so Driver isn't doubled over half the time and see what he does with that.

    With a line full of virgins, inconsistant TE's at best, and no real threat after Driver and Jennings I think the guy has done a great job. When you look at the personnel those QB's with better numbers has to work with you have to wonder what Favre could do if he had that kind of talent around him.

    That and a defense that would show up more than once every few weeks would be nice. It's a little tough to show much when your down three touchdowns and the defense is coming after you every play.

    A little secret. We don't play well against the good teams because our "0" line isn't there yet to hold it's own and our "D" line gets it's *** handed to them.

    We simply don't win the battle at the line of scrimmage. I guess BF could brush up on his blocking and tackling skills. He is a little poor when it comes to that.
     
  12. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    THey interviewed Brett before the game, and even he said that he doesn't trust his legs anymore and can't scramble like he used to, but he's confident that if he has the right protection..he can still make the throws.

    He hasn't lost any velocity/touch on his throws, but when he scrambles around ..he starts to show his age.

    Against a team like San Francisco..he'll look really good because they gave him all day to throw.

    Against a better defense...it will show again.

    Let's be pragmatic about Brett instead of w/rose colored glasses.
     
  13. dxbfan

    dxbfan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2006
    Messages:
    560
    Ratings:
    +0
    Two years ago he had an O line that consisted of Wahle and Rivera in addition to Tausch and Clifton, two years ago he had Javon Walker in addition to Driver, two years ago he had Green rushing for three (or was it four) consecutive 1000 yd seasons.

    And if you think he's just back to what he was two years ago and if he's done that with a supporting cast around him has a got a whole lot worse, then he must have got better!
     
  14. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2005
    Messages:
    1,922
    Ratings:
    +38
    All true but just as true is the fact that Grossman, Smith and about 20 other NFL QB's couldn't bring BF's jock to the stadium let alone contribute what he can. Legs or no legs.

    He showed a former #1 pick how to play QB in the NFL yesterday. The guy picked ahead of the guy we have behind Favre if I'm not mistaken.

    People stating Favre could get a good team far into the playoffs didn't come up with that opinion out of the blue. Wouldn't blame him for how he's judged by some here to do just that.

    He's had a couple games where he wasn't very good. I guess now that he is human he ought to go. Sooner we get the whiney *** kid in there so we can watch him bitch at his "0" linemen the better.
     
  15. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    Warhawk..we're not trying to compare Favre to the other QBs...
    Just because Favre isn't the same as he used to be, doesn't mean
    we have to counter and say other QBs in the league still can't hold his jock. No need for defensive stuff..

    That's also a given. For years, other QBs couldn't touch Favre.
    Using that to further the cause of pro-favre really isn't necessary.

    All people are saying is that it's nearing the end for Favre and he's still a great player even still...

    And Alex Smith really can't hang w/Favre anyway. He was a lousy #1 pick and Green Bay benefited mightily by getting the true no.1 QB in that draft.

    As you all saw yesterday Alex Smith has a poor arm, and poor decision making skills. Their loss is our gain.
     
  16. warhawk

    warhawk Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2005
    Messages:
    1,922
    Ratings:
    +38
    Well if people were only stating Bf is playing great still I wouldn't have written what I did.

    The post quoted in my reply certainly didn't say that.

    I don't wear rose colored glasses and those that know me here have heard me call a spade a spade a hundred times.

    I said after the NE game that we need BF to play a GREAT game against good teams not lousy like he did that day. We have to have Brett Favre at a high level in these games to stand a chance.

    To say, however, it is BF that is the problem with not beating the better teams is not looking very deep or am I wrong there?

    As I said before I do not see us winning the line of scrimmage against good teams and that, IMO, is more of why we lose those games than BF.
     
  17. PackerChick

    PackerChick Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2005
    Messages:
    3,143
    Ratings:
    +1
    He is simply trying to make the most out of the team he has.
     
  18. Cal2GreenBay

    Cal2GreenBay Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2006
    Messages:
    468
    Ratings:
    +1
    Yeah..I agree. The line just looked good against a San Francisco team that hasn't been sacking people lately. That in tern gave Favre time to look good.
     
  19. packedhouse01

    packedhouse01 Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2005
    Messages:
    1,560
    Ratings:
    +1
    This is a bad team with a serious lack of developed talent. He's playing with three rookie linemen and one bonafide receiver. He has one running back that could be classified as an outstanding player. His defense basically can't stop anyone. Unfortunately for Brett, he's all they have. Does he make too many bad decisions? Yes he does. Only a fool would deny that. What is a shame is that the last two GM's have surrounded him with almost laughable talent. I'd love to see Brett, at this age, playing with his offensive line from two years ago and a couple of receivers like Sterling Sharpe, Robert Brooks, Keith Jackson, Chumura, Donald Driver and then watch what he could do. Ahman Green would be a pro bowl player too. Instead Brett is playing with three rookie lineman and Donald Driver and a bunch of guys that maybe in a few years no one will remember. Is Brett the same player as five years ago, no he's not, but part of that is that he also isn't surrounded with nearly the talent.
     
  20. Cdnfavrefan

    Cdnfavrefan Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    Messages:
    1,624
    Ratings:
    +0
    Obviosly I can agree that Brett isn't used to be but the fact that he's only 70% of what he used to be and is STILL one of the better QB's in the leageu just shows how great he actually was and is.
    I havn't seen Trom I'm wondering if he sent Abz to test the water. LOL
     
  21. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,338
    Ratings:
    +0
    I'm just going to reply to this with facts. 17 TDs with only 12 picks. Once again over 3k yards. LOTS of broken sacks, that would have been sacks if it were a lesser QB. By the end of this season, we'll see good numbers once again from #4.

    These aren't rose-colored lenses, they're straight up facts. And this is with one of the youngest, perhaps the youngest, OLs in the league. Next year will be even better.
     
  22. umair

    umair Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2006
    Messages:
    923
    Ratings:
    +0


    correct me if im wrong he has a qb rating of 78. that isnt all that bad, he had some bad games this season but dosent every qb?

    i know it and everyone knows it when the team plays good favre plays good.

    look at last year, he had a bad team around him and his #S where bad, this year the team is better and his numbers are better.
     
  23. Zombieslayer

    Zombieslayer Cheesehead

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,338
    Ratings:
    +0
    Well, I'm not really a QB rating guy, but I think the most important numbers are points. With a mediocre offense (Driver deserves Pro Bowl recognition, but nobody else), we're #17 in points, which is middle of the pack. As of last week, Favre was #10 in the NFL in TDs thrown. I imagine with two yesterday, he might go up to #9.

    Yes, EVERY QB has a bad game. Favre had three bad ones in a row before this, and I'm thinking it was injuries. Favre's like the imaginary Rocky Balboa. He'll keep fighting no matter what the odds are, and no matter how badly he's hurt.

    Intangibles like this need to be considered. We don't have to worry about having a strong #2 QB in there with Favre around. We know he'll be the starter week after week. There's never been a QB in NFL history that is that consistent, ever.

    I just see 2007 being better than 2006. MM will have a better understanding of what needs to be done. The OL will be more mature. Jennings will be more mature. Hopefully we'll pick up a decent TE in the offseason or the draft. Hopefully that TE will actually be able to go out and catch passes instead of staying back to block. As will Green/Morency/Henderson (if Henderson comes back).

    Favre's numbers this year are decent. Not great, but decent. next year will be better. Have patience, my friends.
     

Share This Page