Arrogant General Managers

tynimiller

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Can we be clear here, anyone who is in the top-32 jobs in their industry is going to have a certain degree of earned arrogance and many will have a LOT of unearned arrogance mixed in as well. So, yeah, I think the vast majority of NFL GMs are arrogant and honestly believe that they know more about evaluating players and building teams than anyone else, why would they think otherwise? Many of them are wrong but by getting to the point of being an NFL GM they've experienced nothing in their lives to show them they're wrong.

Arrogance is a trait not earned but chose in my experiences. Experience or success is not a prerequisite for it at all.

But I don't disagree with you in that many GMs, and top players have the glaring issue of it.
 

Heyjoe4

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The name Julius Peppers ring a bell? At the time I bet you liked the Marty Bennett addition along with Jared Cook.

This isn't the only team organized this way. The Chiefs are for one. The difference is GB has a chairman/president while other teams have an owner. I stated this once before in another thread I am too tired to dig up.
Forgot about Peppers but obviously a great pickup. Bennett was a joke. Jared Cook????? Remember the Dallas game? They could have had him for $3 mil year and decided that was too much. He went to NO. That was stupid.
 

Packer Fan in SD

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At the time I really liked those signings.
Forgot to quote, but being honest in response to Poppa. Yeah turned out not so well but I thought they were good at the time.
 
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I'm in favor of keeping Rodgers as well but I don't think the Packers offering him $125 million guaranteed money should be considered a smart move at this point in his career. I would rather prefer to restructure his current deal, guaranteeing part of the money still left on it but don't add additional money or seasons.
Thats fine I’d love to hear your suggestion of what you think Rodgers would agree to?
What do you have in mind for his current contract 2021-2023 as far as guaranteed monies? A dollar $ number will suffice
 

Packer Fan in SD

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I don’t get the hate for Murphy or Gute. Team is not just financially sound but soon to be even better after Titletown district is finished, team winning and soooo close to SB last couple of years, FA signings, resigning our core, I don’t get it. If I were majority owner, both getting bonuses.
 
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I don’t get the hate for Murphy or Gute. Team is not just financially sound but soon to be even better after Titletown district is finished, team winning and soooo close to SB last couple of years, FA signings, resigning our core, I don’t get it. If I were majority owner, both getting bonuses.
We’re a bunch of whiners. We’ve been pretty spoiled actually. We’re what.. the 2nd or 3rd most successful team going back 30 years. We’d probably be complaining if we Won the Super Bowl.
 

mradtke66

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Jared Cook????? Remember the Dallas game? They could have had him for $3 mil year and decided that was too much. He went to NO. That was stupid.

Revisionist history. We made him an offer, more than what he ended getting in FA. The offer was rejected, supposedly by Cook's agent without even presenting it to Cook. We in turn offered more or less the same deal of Bennett and he accepted.

That was not a mistake by the front office. Assuming the report of the offer is accurate, it is someone in Cook's camp that screwed up.
 

Heyjoe4

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You say that now. What was your opinion then? What about when Jimmy G was signed next season to replace him?
Hey Papa, including your last reply, please don't assume to understand what I'm thinking at any point in time. I don';t even know what I'm thinking at any point in time. I'm not upset with your comments, would just appreciate a little more thoughtfulness on your part before you hit the "reply" button.

Like just about everyone else, I admit I thought Marty Bennett and Graham were good to great news. Again, Bennett was a joke (I think he wanted to become a musical superstar.) Yeah, right. Graham was in decline, but that was hard to discern when they signed him. In your last post you mentioned Jared Cook. Ironically, where I initially liked Bennett and Graham I had no strong feelings one way or another, about Cook,but out of these three, he was by far the better TE. Yes there was the Dallas playoff game and the great sideline catch from Rodgers. Those two guys seemed to be on the same page as no one else but Cook could have caught that pass. Still, it wasn't an easy pass to bring in, he was inches from being out of bounds. That's one play but I thought his other play in GB warranted a new contract. I think it was Ted who decided $3 mil year was too much (I think that was the offer) and he went out and played better at NO than any of out TEs.

I completely forgot about the Julius Peppers acquisition and how valuable he was, so props to Thompson on that one. Peppers is an athletic freak who probably could have played longer. And Charles Woodson requires no additional comment.

So yeah just don't assume too much. This thread all started out as the arrogance of GMs and, as usual, morphed into something else. Ted picked his spots. My only regret is that he soften his D&D philosophy. But who knows who was available during those years and at what price.

When people say that GB didn't participate in FA this year, I respond with an emphatic "NO"! Going back a little, they resigned the best left OT in football, they kept Aaron Jones with a very reasonable contract, and kept Kenny clark in the fold. That takes money and as we've seen, GB is flirting with the cap right now. I'd be happy if they free enough space to sign the rookies, and look forward to a good season (well, there's the Rodgers thing, which is getting stale).

Finally, Gluten made a huge move in FA a few years ago with the acquisition of the Smith Bros, Amos and Turner. Those additions had a huge impact on the team. So I would disagree with anyone who suggests Gluten is timid in FA.

Hope that makes sense. I won't assume how you felt at any point in time if you return the favor.
 

TAYLORBOY

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I don't think you can classify what is going on in the front office as arrogance..

I do think it can be classified as the culture/philosophy that has been generated over the last several years

I think the personality of how he ran the office stated with Ted Thompson..

He only had press conferences as required by the NFL

He was a quiet man and kept to himself...he dida good job building the team but was very conservative in his approach but I don't think he reached out to his players on a personal level...leaving that to the HC

Gute grew up under TT and seems to have developed some of his traits as far as how he runs the GM office....IMHO
 

Poppa San

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. My only regret is that he soften his D&D philosophy. But who knows who was available during those years and at what price.
My personal bleacher seat opinion is Ted had some medical issue in '12 or'13. IIRC there were rumors about that time. His player judgement and procurement started suffering after that. And it continued trending down. The occasional hits grew more sparse. The ole boys network and pride kept him employed until there was going to be a revolt by MM and the FO. That is when Murphy was forced or able (no sure which) to retire him. All my opinion based on scant reports.
 
D

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Thats fine I’d love to hear your suggestion of what you think Rodgers would agree to?
What do you have in mind for his current contract 2021-2023 as far as guaranteed monies? A dollar $ number will suffice

I honestly don't know if any amount of guaranteed money will change Rodgers' mind at this point. It seems he mostly has an issue with the philosophy of the front office.

I don’t get the hate for Murphy or Gute. Team is not just financially sound but soon to be even better after Titletown district is finished, team winning and soooo close to SB last couple of years, FA signings, resigning our core, I don’t get it. If I were majority owner, both getting bonuses.

It seems you have missed there's a rift between the front office and the star quarterback, resulting in fans taking sides regarding the issue.

We’re a bunch of whiners. We’ve been pretty spoiled actually. We’re what.. the 2nd or 3rd most successful team going back 30 years. We’d probably be complaining if we Won the Super Bowl.

The Packers not winning more Super Bowls while having HOF quarterbacks starting since 1992 is the main reason for people complaining though.

In your last post you mentioned Jared Cook. Ironically, where I initially liked Bennett and Graham I had no strong feelings one way or another, about Cook,but out of these three, he was by far the better TE. Yes there was the Dallas playoff game and the great sideline catch from Rodgers. Those two guys seemed to be on the same page as no one else but Cook could have caught that pass. Still, it wasn't an easy pass to bring in, he was inches from being out of bounds. That's one play but I thought his other play in GB warranted a new contract. I think it was Ted who decided $3 mil year was too much (I think that was the offer) and he went out and played better at NO than any of out TEs.

Just for the record, Cook signed a two-year, $10.6 million deal with the Raiders after leaving Green Bay in the 2017 offseason.
 

Heyjoe4

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I honestly don't know if any amount of guaranteed money will change Rodgers' mind at this point. It seems he mostly has an issue with the philosophy of the front office.



It seems you have missed there's a rift between the front office and the star quarterback, resulting in fans taking sides regarding the issue.



The Packers not winning more Super Bowls while having HOF quarterbacks starting since 1992 is the main reason for people complaining though.



Just for the record, Cook signed a two-year, $10.6 million deal with the Raiders after leaving Green Bay in the 2017 offseason.
I didn't know that. Still Would have been worth it to keep him.
 

ARPackFan

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My personal bleacher seat opinion is Ted had some medical issue in '12 or'13. IIRC there were rumors about that time. His player judgement and procurement started suffering after that. And it continued trending down. The occasional hits grew more sparse. The ole boys network and pride kept him employed until there was going to be a revolt by MM and the FO. That is when Murphy was forced or able (no sure which) to retire him. All my opinion based on scant reports.

I have similar observations which is why I hold Mark Murphy culpable for not recognizing there was a problem and acting accordingly by removing Thompson as GM. In my opinion, Murphy was not fully engaged in the football side of the organization as interactions with the staff and players should have shown there were issues with individual and organizational health. He should have been fired along with Thompson.


I don’t get the hate for Murphy or Gute. Team is not just financially sound but soon to be even better after Titletown district is finished, team winning and soooo close to SB last couple of years, FA signings, resigning our core, I don’t get it. If I were majority owner, both getting bonuses.

See above for my opinion on Murphy. Jury is still out on Gutekunst. Let's see how the Packers do without a future HOF QB under center for a few years. He may be a great GM or at the other end of the spectrum be included with Harry Frazee (Red Sox Owner that sold Babe Ruth to the Yankees).
 

Heyjoe4

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I have similar observations which is why I hold Mark Murphy culpable for not recognizing there was a problem and acting accordingly by removing Thompson as GM. In my opinion, Murphy was not fully engaged in the football side of the organization as interactions with the staff and players should have shown there were issues with individual and organizational health. He should have been fired along with Thompson.




See above for my opinion on Murphy. Jury is still out on Gutekunst. Let's see how the Packers do without a future HOF QB under center for a few years. He may be a great GM or at the other end of the spectrum be included with Harry Frazee (Red Sox Owner that sold Babe Ruth to the Yankees).
With Rodgers on board, Gluten hasn't really been tested as a GM IMO. If Rodgers is gone, or if there is a trade, then we can better gauge how good (or bad) Gluten is. A lot of GMs would probably look good with a first-ballot HOF QB on the team. Probably goes for HC as well.
 
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So your saying Bill Belichek is over-rated?

Belichick put together a roster and coached a defensive unit that finished within the top 10 in points allowed in 17 of 21 seasons. He wasn't just riding a future HOF quarterback to success.
 

Heyjoe4

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Belichick put together a roster and coached a defensive unit that finished within the top 10 in points allowed in 17 of 21 seasons. He wasn't just riding a future HOF quarterback to success.
That's an interesting stat about NE's defense. Winning six Lombardis, and having regular top ten Ds are not easy things to accomplish if the age of parity.
 

Heyjoe4

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So your saying Bill Belichek is over-rated?
No Bellichik is most certainly NOT overrated. Captain pointed out that NE had a top 10 D for 17 out of 21 seasons. It wasn't all Brady. And that's a lesson GB should have learned from the Favre years. You have to consistently support your superstar QB because he can't win it all alone.
 
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Belichick put together a roster and coached a defensive unit that finished within the top 10 in points allowed in 17 of 21 seasons. He wasn't just riding a future HOF quarterback to success.
Captain!.... I just wanted to say I love you
 

gopkrs

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No Bellichik is most certainly NOT overrated. Captain pointed out that NE had a top 10 D for 17 out of 21 seasons. It wasn't all Brady. And that's a lesson GB should have learned from the Favre years. You have to consistently support your superstar QB because he can't win it all alone.
Everybody tries. You have to have good scouts and good coaches...to start.
 

Heyjoe4

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Everybody tries. You have to have good scouts and good coaches...to start.
Amen to that. Everyone focuses on the draft without giving much thought to the year-round hard work of scouting amongst hundreds if not thousands of college players, all while spending nights at the nearest Motel 6. And the position coaches are huge, and underrated.
 

JoePack

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Different approach:
When you have a new QB and happen to win a SB shortly after his arrival, you trade him for as many picks as possible and start all over again, drafting a QB in the 1st round until you hit. Instead of paying millions of dollars on the QB, start paying to keep a strong defense and the players needed to keep a fresh QB upright. No more of this QB trying to control everything and paying out so much cash you can't keep the players you need.
Why? Just using the Farve, Rodgers scenerio. 2 SB's with BF, and 1 with AR. Why keep them if you aren't getting there?
 

ARPackFan

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Different approach:
When you have a new QB and happen to win a SB shortly after his arrival, you trade him for as many picks as possible and start all over again, drafting a QB in the 1st round until you hit. Instead of paying millions of dollars on the QB, start paying to keep a strong defense and the players needed to keep a fresh QB upright. No more of this QB trying to control everything and paying out so much cash you can't keep the players you need.
Why? Just using the Farve, Rodgers scenerio. 2 SB's with BF, and 1 with AR. Why keep them if you aren't getting there?

That is really not as unconventional as it may look in the current NFL where QBs command a huge percentage of the cap. Lots of articles out there on the net that support your premise as wining SB teams have a QB with a cap hit less than 10% of the team cap. It would be a bold strategy for a GM to stick to because when you find "the guy" at QB and the fan base loves him it would be difficult to trade them away.


https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/max-qb-sb-ring-facts-data-ryan-mccumber#:~:text=We collected our data from overthecap.com.&text=Of the last 15 Super,cap of the same year.
 

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