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Am I the only one that wants to see a switch back to the 4-3?

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by CHIpackFAN, Jan 7, 2014.

  1. CHIpackFAN

    CHIpackFAN Cheesehead

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    I would not mind if this team went back to a 4-3 defense. Or, would just getting rid of Capers and going with another 3-4 scheme be good enough? I would like to think that we have the personnel to make the switch. If not all of the personnel, at least a few players are on the roster. I know we have the D tackles for a 4-3. Worthy, Daniels, Boyd, Raji (maybe), Jolly. Datone Jones can play DE. Can Perry go back to DE? Is Clay too light for DE? Will clay be any good as an 4-3 LB? Not concerned about the CB's, they should be fine. S may still be an issue if the D line doesn't generate a pass rush. When AL Harris and Woodson were at DB, we played a lot of man coverage. I think this D flourishes when they play man coverage. I think we have decent players on D, maybe they are in the wrong scheme!?!? I think with the players listed, we could have a good front 4 if not front 7 in a 4-3 scheme. Thoughts???
     
  2. TheStone

    TheStone Cheesehead

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    The only thing which makes me even think about that, is our talent level at LB.
    I learned that with the 3-4, it is easier to find talented pass rushers. 4-3 DE's
    don't grow on trees, but 3-4 OLBs can be found in later rounds.

    We tried the street free agents (Walden, Zombo, Mulumba) and we spent high
    draft picks (Perry, Jones).
    Problem is: We still haven't found a bookend for Clay. And btw, if you watch
    the Claymaker play, you quickly notice that he needs a breather now and then.
    If he has to play almost every down, he's still a great OLB, but his sacks go down significantly.

    So besides Clay, we need 2 good OLBs to have a good front seven.
    With a 4-3 we would need to draft/sign 2 really good DEs.
    That won't be easy. That ain't cheap either!!!

    Now what is on the roster? Will Perry or/and Jones develope into players worth a first round pick?
    Could Jones play DE? (Don't think, he will be good...)
    Does Neal continue to improve at OLB? I think, if he has to learn ANOTHER position, he
    would try his luck elsewhere (He's a UFA...).
    How's the draft this year? Any good players available at #21 in the first round?
    The Packers draft and develope. Is there a reason why some players on defense just
    don't grow into above average NFL starters? (House, Perry, Jennings)

    If someone has any sure answers to these questions, give Mark Murphy a call.
    Dom Capers thinks the best answer is the 3-4 defense. Trust the experts!
     
  3. Dan115

    Dan115 Cheesehead

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    I would keep the 3-4 but not positive on Capers.
     
  4. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    Swithing back to the 4-3 would require us to do a lot of flipping and flopping guys around into positions that they either have not played, or has been a long time since they played. It would be a rough(er) season defense wise with guys adjusting.

    What we need:
    1 - New DC
    2- better luck with injuries
    3- Players to play hard 1000% of the time.

    Keep the 3-4, that is what we are built for right now. Dallas was a 3-4 team, then they switched for this season.......look at their defense = way worse than ours. Not because of the 4-3, because they made the switch and it puts guys into positions that they don't know or simply are not good at playing.
     
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  5. HardRightEdge

    HardRightEdge Cheesehead

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    There's one reason I doubt the Packers would even consider a switch to a 4-3:

    6 years, $70 mil, $20.5 mil. signing bonus.
     
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  6. Packerlifer

    Packerlifer Cheesehead

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    Just what they don't need in Green Bay is more instability on the defensive side and a second radical conversion and restaffing of coaches in 6 years won't solve the problem of a lack of identity on that side of the ball.

    It's the players, not the coaches or the scheme or system. Excessive injuries are a significant part of the problem but they also just don't have enough good players. Land a safety and nose tackle this year and get some injured guys back and the defense could at least get back to its 2012 level by next season.

    Get a couple of better 3-4 linebackers and see positive development from Datone Jones and Jerel Worthy and we may be almost back to 2010.
     
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  7. Dan115

    Dan115 Cheesehead

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    It would NOT surprise me if Capers retires.
     
  8. weeds

    weeds Cheesehead

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    If he does, I hope he does it sooner than later....just so the Pack can find someone OUTSIDE the organization to replace him. I don't see the Packers making a radical shift back to a 4-3 (and I've never been a fan of this particular 3-4) ... just don't see it.
     
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  9. adambr2

    adambr2 Cheesehead

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    I'm pretty sure Capers has already gone on the record in the last month to say he's not retiring.
     
  10. CHIpackFAN

    CHIpackFAN Cheesehead

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    All valid points. All signs point to us staying with the 3-4. Would Wade Phillips a valid Capers replacement? Are there any other DC available?
     
  11. profile_removed

    profile_removed Cheesehead

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    We don't have the horses to run ANYTHING! We don't have linebackers so we can't run 3-4. We don't have DBs so we can't run a 3-4 either. The ONLY thing we MIGHT be able to run is a 6-2-3, and to get the LBs we'd have to move Clay and Mulumba inside.
     
  12. GoPGo

    GoPGo Cheesehead

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    The only problem with a 4-3 is what to do with Matthews. He's too small for a DE and adding weight would have a negative effect on his game, which is speed and explosiveness. That said, I do think he could be an absolute beast as a 4-3 MLB. But this isn't going to happen anyway, so that's about all the time I'm going to waste on the subject.
     
  13. Sunshinepacker

    Sunshinepacker Cheesehead

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    Just curious where you learned that pass rushing OLBs can be found in later rounds for the 3-4? The Packers have been trying for YEARS to find a complement to Clay (a first rounder) and have pretty much failed.
     
  14. mradtke66

    mradtke66 Cheesehead

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    Dear god no. Not him. All he does is rush and play a single high safety. Was it last year that everyone else who played us played a 2-deep shell and shut or slowed us down? The Texas didn't and we destroyed them? Hung 40 something points on them?

    No. He's even more stubborn.
     
  15. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    Most teams fail to even get one elite player like Matthews. Packer fans are unsatisfied that we haven't hit the double bonus.
     
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  16. NelsonsLongCatch

    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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    I've said a number of times before: MOVING TO A 4-3 IS A HORRIBLE IDEA. The defense's best player is one of the best 3-4 OLB's in the game. He's the only player on defense with "WOW" moments. He's the only game-changer on the defense right now. You don't change an entire defensive scheme to accommodate average players on the hunch that they'll excel in a 4-3.

    The problem with the defense is the lack of game changing players. When the Packers won the Super Bowl in 2010, Nick Collins, Clay Matthews and Charles Woodson were game changing players. These were players who could substantially affect games.
     
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  17. NelsonsLongCatch

    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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    But Super Bowl teams have more than one game changing player.
     
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  18. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    Agree !!

    Ravens had: Ray Lewis, Paul Kruger, Haloti Ngata, Ed reed, Bernard pollard, Donnell elerbe, Terrell suggs

    That is a damn good defensive top crew. To bad for them that they stacked their deck so heavy and couldn't afford to pay all those guys big money when it came due.... and one retirement. Whom ever says defense does not win you games is wrong, look at the difference in the ravens since their superbowl......because It damn sure wasnt that overpaid QB Joe Fluke-o that was the game changer all season for them, in fact he only got hot for a couple games, otherwise he lost them several key games that year.
     
  19. pacmaniac

    pacmaniac Cheesehead

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    Capers quote from yesterday: "We have to figure out what our group’s going to be and we’ll design what we’ll do off what our group is going to be".

    Strange that he's been here for 5 years and still hasn't figured out what he wants the defense to be.
     
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  20. Oshkoshpackfan

    Oshkoshpackfan YUT !!!

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    Seems to me, he is wanting to be a hitch hiker..... as well he should be.
     
  21. El Guapo

    El Guapo Cheesehead

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    Well Capers could be referring to the notion that it's a defense with more youth than veterans...so a rift with TT's personnel strategy. If the group is going to be youthful then he might need to change the design since recent articles have stated that his 3-4 is tough for young players to execute properly. I'm not arguing that his is what Capers meant, just throwing out the notion.

    There is no doubt that we need more playmakers on defense. Some teams go all-in like the Ravens, others go long-term. You can't do both in the modern NFL, so you need to make trade-offs that leave holes in other parts of your roster. Obviously you do the best to eliminate every hole but the stacked team is the rare exception.
     
  22. Southpaw

    Southpaw Endorphin Junkie

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    Sounds to me like a guy who is out of answers.

    "Hey guys figure it out amongst yourselves then I'll see what I can draw up"

    get him the hell out of here
     
  23. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Let's get the entire paragraph to show the whole story

    http://www.jsonline.com/sports/pack...of-packers-defense-b99180291z1-239362171.html

     
  24. armand34

    armand34 Cheesehead

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    3-4 stays, severely in need of another Safety/Edge Rusher/Presence on the D-Line, and more then likely another Cover Corner...i dream of having a front 7 like 49ers, may not ever happen in my lifetime.
     
  25. longtimefan

    longtimefan Super Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Sounds to me like he he wanted to play it a certain way, but was limited in what he could do based on the players he had...

    Dig at Ted?
     

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