5 Moves for Every NFC North Team over the Offseason

[Dantés]

If, as you mentioned previously, you're looking for Packer personnel to publicly proclaim he was out of shape, then the discussion is probably over, reasonable or not.

Although it is confirmed that they fined him for his weight and it's unclear how much, how often, or how recently. That, in essence, is the team publicly proclaiming him out of shape.

 

[Dantés]

Lacy has had 10 or less carries in eight out of 51 regular season games. While it's a small sample size there's no doubt in my mind he's at his best when wearing defenses down.

That would seem to follow given his running style and how most backs like that function.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Lacy has had 10 or less carries in eight out of 51 regular season games. While it's a small sample size there's no doubt in my mind he's at his best when wearing defenses down.

But, without wearing himself out first?

I threw the 5-10 carries/game out there, because people seem to worry about his conditioning and ability to stay on the field. I'm not so convinced that he wouldn't be less effective or more effective based on his per game carries. However, I don't think he will ever be the workhorse RB that some expect out of the position. The bottom line for me, if the guy can stay healthy and maintain a reasonable* weight and conditioning, he can be a very effective back in a 2 back plattoon. I think he and Monty could potentially give defenses something to really think about and provide the Packers a running attack that really compliments the passing game.

*Reasonable: I doubt Eddie will ever be a guy that gets to and stays at 235 lbs. But if he can maintain his conditioning at 235-260 lbs, for $2M I will take my chances.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

But, without wearing himself out first?

That has been the problem with Lacy over the past two seasons.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That has been the problem with Lacy over the past two seasons.

I guess its all about perception and expectations. 2015 was a disappointment in some ways, but he still averaged 4.1/carry. Compare that to his other 3 seasons. 2013 (4.1) 2014 (4.6) and 2016 (5.7)

Obviously, if the Packers or any other team signs Lacy for $2M and not a lot of guarantees, their expectations are probably somewhere in the middle between yours and mine.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

If, as you mentioned previously, you're looking for Packer personnel to publicly proclaim he was out of shape, then the discussion is probably over, reasonable or not.

I would consider that evidence. It doesn't mean it's the only thing I would consider as evidence, however, and if someone has something to show, I'll gladly consider that for what it's worth as well.

So far, no one has, so that's where I'm at.

 

[Dantés]

I would consider that evidence. It doesn't mean it's the only thing I would consider as evidence, however, and if someone has something to show, I'll gladly consider that for what it's worth as well.

So far, no one has, so that's where I'm at.

I have. I haven't heard any reply yet.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

I have. I haven't heard any reply yet.

I seem to have missed it. What would that be, exactly?

 

[Dantés]

What the reports indicate is that Lacy came into the season in better shape and then added weight back as the year wore on. Then he got hurt. I think most recognize that he can be pretty effective when he's heavier than ideal (though in 2015 he was even pushing those bounds), but it would seem that staying healthy while that big is another story.



Yes, it's reasonable. So were the links and reports provided not satisfactory?

Here you go.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Here you go.

Which reports are you referring to? Do you have a link?

 

[Dantés]

Which reports are you referring to? Do you have a link?

I quoted it for you in the original post. Go back one page.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Which reports are you referring to? Do you have a link?

I totally get what you are saying. Most everything that centers around Lacy and his weight issue is strictly "the eye test" used by fans and reporters. However, even as a firm believer in bringing Lacy back, I think the reports of him being fined for being over weight, McCarthy's comments at the end of 2015, as well as his self enrollment in the Tony Horton program last year are all pretty good indicators (to me) that he struggles with weight issues and the Packers would prefer he had it under control.

The question that the Packers have to ask themselves is very simple: "With everything we know about Eddie, is he worth the price?" The bonus here, the Packers organization has a lot more information than fans, media or other teams in which to make their decision.

 

[Half Empty]

Although it is confirmed that they fined him for his weight and it's unclear how much, how often, or how recently. That, in essence, is the team publicly proclaiming him out of shape.

Don't necessarily agree, but at least you're checking off one of the boxes I keep asking for. For personnel matters, we need the Packers to officially sanction a player before we can discuss shortcomings. In another thread, you specify only FO as the source you you'll accept for facts. Tells us when not to devote time to discussions that depend on other sources, so thanks for that.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

I quoted it for you in the original post. Go back one page.

Okay, I think I found what you are referring to.

The only mention of a fine I found in your link was this one:

In fact, according to Pete Dougherty of the Green Bay Press-Gazette, Packers coach Mike McCarthy fined Lacy for not making weight over the last couple of seasons. It's it not known how much the fines were or how often the fines occurred.

It would be helpful to know when those fines occurred. "Over the last couple of seasons" doesn't tell us if he was fined last season, or the season prior, or both. It simply means he was fined at some point during the last two seasons.

He might well have been overweight, but as of now, I certainly can't conclude he was with any degree of certainty.

 

[Half Empty]

I would consider that evidence. It doesn't mean it's the only thing I would consider as evidence, however, and if someone has something to show, I'll gladly consider that for what it's worth as well.

So far, no one has, so that's where I'm at.

Before looking further, what's wrong with the link I provided and the one someone else after that? Then, I'll know where to look for something acceptable.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Before looking further, what's wrong with the link I provided and the one someone else after that? Then, I'll know where to look for something acceptable.

I had to go back to find it, but the link you supplied is perfectly acceptable (assuming we are both talking about the link from ProFootbalTalk.com). I must have missed that one earlier.

Point conceded - If the report is accurate, it appears Lacy was indeed overweight during the 2016 season. Which means, of course, Caveat Emptor - It might be time to move on.

 

[Dantés]

Don't necessarily agree, but at least you're checking off one of the boxes I keep asking for. For personnel matters, we need the Packers to officially sanction a player before we can discuss shortcomings. In another thread, you specify only FO as the source you you'll accept for facts. Tells us when not to devote time to discussions that depend on other sources, so thanks for that.

Are you sure you're not confusing me with someone else? Because this seems to be out of left field. I guess I asked about Raji, but someone provided me some information and I thanked them. So I'm a little lost.

 

[Half Empty]

I had to go back to find it, but the link you supplied is perfectly acceptable (assuming we are both talking about the link from ProFootbalTalk.com). I must have missed that one earlier.

Point conceded - If the report is accurate, it appears Lacy was indeed overweight during the 2016 season. Which means, of course, Caveat Emptor - It might be time to move on.

Well, darn, that pretty well takes the wind out of my petty bickering sails.

 

[Half Empty]

Are you sure you're not confusing me with someone else? Because this seems to be out of left field. I guess I asked about Raji, but someone provided me some information and I thanked them. So I'm a little lost.

I interpreted this one, about Lacy, to mean that the previous links weren't acceptable and that only public admonishment by the team counts.

Although it is confirmed that they fined him for his weight and it's unclear how much, how often, or how recently. That, in essence, is the team publicly proclaiming him out of shape.

I interpreted this one, in the Ted Era thread, to mean that folks need to use FO data, or it's not reliable.

What facts? I haven't seen anything from FO yet on games lost. That's what I generally find the most reliable.

 

[Dantés]

I interpreted this one, about Lacy, to mean that the previous links weren't acceptable and that only public admonishment by the team counts.



I interpreted this one, in the Ted Era thread, to mean that folks need to use FO data, or it's not reliable.

Oh so this is just miscommunication.

Post one, I was meaning to agree with you by saying that, in addition to all the other reports, the front office fining Lacy would seem to be an indictment of his conditioning from the team.

Post two, I was asking Cap what facts he was referring to because I haven't seen numbers come out from Footballoutsiders (FO), who generally put out really good injury statistics.

 

[Half Empty]

As you say, then, miscommunication. I missed the "in addition to" underlying assumption in the first one, and the "FO is reliable, what were you referring to?" in the second one. So, another petty bickering opportunity wasted.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Well, darn, that pretty well takes the wind out of my petty bickering sails.

Sorry 'bout that, takes all the fun out it.......

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I guess its all about perception and expectations. 2015 was a disappointment in some ways, but he still averaged 4.1/carry. Compare that to his other 3 seasons. 2013 (4.1) 2014 (4.6) and 2016 (5.7)

First of all Lacy averaged only 5.1 yards per carry last season. As Mondio correctly pointed out he didn't have a single touchdown in 2016 though, something that has to be considered when talking about his performance as well.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

First of all Lacy averaged only 5.1 yards per carry last season. As Mondio correctly pointed out he didn't have a single touchdown in 2016 though, something that has to be considered when talking about his performance as well.

My bad on the stat...thanks for correcting me.

As far as Lacy not scoring a rushing TD in his 5 games, considering it took 11 games and not until Nov. 29th for someone other than Aaron Rodgers to get a rushing TD, I would say that is more of a reflection of the Packers run game than it is on Lacy. He had 23 rushing and 6 receiving TD's in his previous 3 seasons.

 

[Mondio]

if people are going to tout his 5.1 YPC, it should also be noted that not a single one of those 5.1 yards resulted in even a single TD. There are reasons he got his 5.1, and reasons he didn't have a TD. 5.1 is nothing to sneeze at, and if it was because he's such a punishing runner, I wouldn't think that 1 TD be too much to ask. I believe the reasons for the nice average and the lack of touchdowns had a lot to do with what I mentioned before.