2020 Dantés Draft Thread

tynimiller

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Well done!

I'd add Charlie Taumoepeau TE (Portland St) to the TEs with a 6th/7th round grade.

6'2"
240lbs
32.25 Arms
9.5 Hands
4.75 - Forty

Top 10 fastest 40 time, bench press,...
Third highest vertical
Fourth best broad jump
Second best 3 cone
Second best 20 yd shuttle
 
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Well done!

I'd add Charlie Taumoepeau TE (Portland St) to the TEs with a 6th/7th round grade.

6'2"
240lbs
32.25 Arms
9.5 Hands
4.75 - Forty

Top 10 fastest 40 time, bench press,...
Third highest vertical
Fourth best broad jump
Second best 3 cone
Second best 20 yd shuttle

If they think he could replace Vitale, I'd be into it.
 

GleefulGary

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I've created something of a big board that combines the players that I personally like and the tendencies that the Packers have demonstrated in the past. Players that would be exceptions to their "rules" are noted in bold. These are guys that I believe would be worth going off-type for.

Wide Receiver:
  • M. Pittman, USC (1st/2nd)
  • D. Mims, Baylor (1st/2nd)
  • J. Reagor, TCU (1st/2nd)
  • B. Aiyuk, ASU (1st/2nd)
  • B. Edwards, SC (2nd/3rd)
  • A. Gibson, MEM (2nd/3rd)
  • D. Duvernay, UT (3rd/4th)
  • V. Jefferson, FLA (3rd/4th)
  • J. Reed, UVA (4th)
  • G. Davis, UCF (4th)
  • J. Hightower, BSU (5th/6th)
  • K. Lipscomb, VAN (5th/6th)
  • F. Swain, FLA (6th)
Cornerback:
  • K. Fulton, LSU (1st/2nd)
  • N. Igbinoghene, AUB (2nd/3rd)
  • T. Burgess, UTAH (3rd/4th)
  • K. Wallace, CLEM (3rd/4th)
  • T. Pride, ND (3rd/4th)
  • M. Harper, SIU (5th/6th)
  • S. Thomas-Oliver, FIU (6th)
  • N. Clarke, UCF (7th)
Offensive Tackle:
  • J. Jones, HOU (1st)
  • E. Cleveland, BSU (2nd)
  • L. Niang, TCU (2nd)
  • M. Peart, UCONN (2nd/3rd)
  • A. Taylor, SCST (3rd/4th)
  • J. Driscoll, AUB (4th)
  • S. Charles, LSU (4th)
  • B. Bartch, STJ (4th)
  • C. McKivitz, WVU (5th)
Linebacker:
  • W. Gay, MSU (2nd)
  • M. Harrison, OSU (2nd)
  • J. Brooks, TTU (2nd/3rd)
  • L. Wilson, WYO (3rd)
  • D. Taylor, COL (3rd)
  • T. Dye, OR (4th)
  • M. Walker, FRSU (5th)
  • S. Bradley, TEM (6th)
  • E. Weaver, CAL (6th)
  • J. Bachi, MSU (7th)
Safety:
  • J. Chinn, SIU (1st/2nd)
  • J. Metellus, UM (4th/5th)
  • A. Brooks, MAR (4th/5th)
  • D. Thomas, AUB (6th)
  • B. Cole, MSU (7th)
Interior Defensive Line:
  • J. Madubuike, TAMU (2nd)
  • J. Lynch, BAY (3rd)
  • D. Hamilton, OSU (4th)
  • L. Fotu, UTAH (4th)
  • J. Penisini, UTAH (6th)
Interior Offensive Line:
  • M. Hennessy, TEM (2nd/3rd)
  • N. Harris, UW (4th/5th)
  • C. Cabral, ASU (5th)
  • J. Runyan, UM (5th)
  • T. Anchrum, CLEM (5th)
  • D. Pinter, BALL (5th/6th)
  • K. Murphy, RHI (6th)
Tight End:
  • A. Trautman, DAY (3rd)
  • H. Bryant, FAU (3rd/4th)
  • D. Asiasi, UCLA (4th)
  • D. Keene, VTU (5th/6th)
  • J. Deguara, CIN (6th)
  • S. McKeon, UM (7th)
  • C. Woerner, UGA (7th)
Running Back:
  • K. Vaughn, VAN (4th/5th)
  • R. Dowdle, SC (5th)
  • D. Dallas, MIA (5th/6th)
  • J. Hasty, BAY (6th)
  • J. Robinson, ILLST (6th/7th)
Edge:
  • D. Tuszka, NDSU (4th/5th)
  • C. Toohill, STAN (5th)
  • C. Coughlin, MIN (6th)
  • T. Galeai, USU (6th)

No AJ Terrell?
 
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I know the Packers are not and should not be in the market for a RB early in the draft, but I just need to express my love for Clyde Edwards-Helaire. That dude is so good. He's my favorite back in this class, bar none. Stud.
 

GleefulGary

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I know the Packers are not and should not be in the market for a RB early in the draft, but I just need to express my love for Clyde Edwards-Helaire. That dude is so good. He's my favorite back in this class, bar none. Stud.

He's good at everything! Nothing he can't do.
 
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So my favorite scenario this year is to move down into the 30's with a team trying to get a QB in the first round, and thus secure a 5th year option.

IND (34), LAC (37), CAR (38), MIA (39), and JAX (42) could all be in that position.

The best comparison to that sort of deal is the 2018 trade up in which the Ravens took Lamar Jackson.

The Eagles gave up #32 and #132 (interestingly, this is virtually equivalent value on the chart to #30) for #52, #125, and a 2019 2nd. As you always value next year picks one round later, I am valuing that 2019 2nd as a 2018 3rd, and placing it right in the middle.

This would mean that, per the chart, the Ravens paid 627 "points" of value to get from #52 to the equivalent of #30, or 28.5 points per slot.

If that's the rate when a QB is involved, then that would put the price at:

114 for IND at #34: Pick #96/97
200 for LAC at #37: Pick #76/77
229 for CAR at #38: Pick #72/73
257 for MIA at #39: Pick #66/67
342 for JAX at #42: Pick #56

I don't know if that rate as I've figure it would actually hold up, but it is a pretty clear comp. If it did, that's quite a bit higher compensation than I was figuring on.
 

tynimiller

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So my favorite scenario this year is to move down into the 30's with a team trying to get a QB in the first round, and thus secure a 5th year option.

IND (34), LAC (37), CAR (38), MIA (39), and JAX (42) could all be in that position.

The best comparison to that sort of deal is the 2018 trade up in which the Ravens took Lamar Jackson.

The Eagles gave up #32 and #132 (interestingly, this is virtually equivalent value on the chart to #30) for #52, #125, and a 2019 2nd. As you always value next year picks one round later, I am valuing that 2019 2nd as a 2018 3rd, and placing it right in the middle.

This would mean that, per the chart, the Ravens paid 627 "points" of value to get from #52 to the equivalent of #30, or 28.5 points per slot.

If that's the rate when a QB is involved, then that would put the price at:

114 for IND at #34: Pick #96/97
200 for LAC at #37: Pick #76/77
229 for CAR at #38: Pick #72/73
257 for MIA at #39: Pick #66/67
342 for JAX at #42: Pick #56

I don't know if that rate as I've figure it would actually hold up, but it is a pretty clear comp. If it did, that's quite a bit higher compensation than I was figuring on.

That's literally the exact scenario I have us doing in my final mock with trades.

I truly believe as I study it only reason to stay at 30 is if our circled right Tackle of the future is sitting there surprisingly OR no suitors. I sense one of those teams you listed will be eyeing Love or Eason in the late 1st for the precious 5th year option. I keep going back and forth on which one does it but I think one of them does.
 

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As you saw I believe it will be INDY looking to get back in. They have a strong OL and just gave up a solid 1st for a stud DL...now they go grab their QB of the future. Makes too much sense to happen though...but if I'm Gute I'm talking things over with them sooner rather than later IF they see the guy they want there.
 

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I still believe drafting a WR in round 1 is a better option than tackle. Historically, much easier to find good/elite tackles in later rounds than receivers.
 
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Who are the good starting tackles currently playing and where were they drafted?
  • Tyron Smith, DAL, 1st
  • Trent Williams, WAS, 1st
  • Jason Peters, PHI, UDFA
  • Lane Johnson, PHI, 1st
  • Dion Dawkins, BUF, 2nd
  • Laremy Tunsil, HOU, 1st
  • Anthony Castonzo, IND, 1st
  • Braden Smith, IND, 2nd
  • Terron Armstead, NO, 3rd
  • Ryan Ramczyk, NO, 1st
  • Jake Matthews, ATL, 1st
  • Donovan Smith, TB, 2nd
  • Taylor Moton, CAR, 2nd
  • Ronnie Stanley, BAL, 1st
  • Orlando Brown, BAL, 3rd
  • Jack Conklin, CLE, 1st
  • Alejandro Villanueva, PIT, UDFA
  • Taylor Decker, DET, 1st
  • David Bakhtiari, GB, 4th
  • Brian O'Neill, MIN, 2nd
  • Garett Bolles, DEN, 1st
  • Ja'Wuan James, DEN, 1st
  • Eric Fisher, KC, 1st
  • Mitchell Schwartz, KC, 2nd
  • Bryan Bulaga, LAC, 1st
  • Trenton Brown, LV, 7th
  • D.J. Humphries, ARI, 1st
  • Joe Staley, SF, 1st
  • Mike McGlinchey, SF, 1st
  • Duane Brown, SEA, 1st
  • Andrew Whitworth, LAR, 2nd
Totals:
  • 1st rd picks: 18 (62%)
  • 2nd rd picks: 7 (24%)
  • 3rd rd picks: 2 (7%)
  • 4th rd picks: 1 (3%)
  • 5th rd picks: 0
  • 6th rd picks: 0
  • 7th rd picks: 1 (3%)
  • UDFA: 2 (7%)
  • Total: 29
Who are the good starting wide receivers in the NFL and where were they drafted?
  • Davante Adams, GB, 2nd
  • Kenny Golladay, DET, 3rd
  • Marvin Jones, DET, 5th
  • Adam Thielen, MIN, UDFA
  • Allen Robinson, CHI, 2nd
  • Juju Smith-Schuster, PIT, 2nd
  • Marquise Brown, BAL, 1st
  • Odell Beckham Jr, CLE, 1st
  • Jarvis Landry, CLE, 2nd
  • A.J. Green, CIN, 1st
  • Tyler Boyd, CIN, 2nd
  • Amari Cooper, DAL, 1st
  • Michael Gallup, DAL, 3rd
  • Alshon Jeffery, PHI, 2nd
  • Terry McLaurin, WAS, 3rd
  • Golden Tate, NYG, 2nd
  • Stefon Diggs, BUF, 5th
  • John Brown, BUF, 3rd
  • Julian Edelman, NE, UDFA
  • Devante Parker, MIA, 1st
  • Will Fuller, HOU, 1st
  • Brandin Cooks, HOU, 1st
  • T.Y. Hilton, IND, 3rd
  • D.J. Chark, JAC, 2nd
  • A.J. Brown, TEN, 2nd
  • Julio Jones, ATL, 1st
  • Calvin Ridley, ATL, 1st
  • D.J. Moore, CAR, 1st
  • Michael Thomas, NO, 2nd
  • Emmanuel Sanders, NO, 3rd
  • Mike Evans, TB, 1st
  • Chris Godwin, TB, 3rd
  • Courtland Sutton, DEN, 2nd
  • Tyreek Hill, KC, 5th
  • Keenan Allen, LAC, 3rd
  • Mike Williams, LAC, 1st
  • Larry Fitzgerald, ARI, 1st
  • DeAndre Hopkins, ARI, 1st
  • Christian Kirk, ARI, 2nd
  • Deebo Samuel, SF, 2nd
  • D.K. Metcalf, SEA, 2nd
  • Tyler Lockett, SEA, 3rd
  • Robert Woods, LAR, 2nd
  • Cooper Kupp, LAR, 3rd
Totals:
  • 1st rd picks: 14 (32%)
  • 2nd rd picks: 15 (34%)
  • 3rd rd picks: 10 (23%)
  • 4th rd picks: 0
  • 5th rd picks: 3 (7%)
  • 6th rd picks: 0
  • 7th rd picks: 0
  • UDFA: 2 (5%)
  • Total: 44
So which position is it easier to find good to great players after round 1? That would be wide receiver, by a mile. 68% of the good to great starters at receiver in the league right now were taken after round one. A mere 38% of tackles are in that same boat.

I'm 100% on board with taking a WR at 30. My preference is actually to trade down a bit and then take one. But that's certainly not because it's easier to find a tackle later, because that's just false.
 

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A mock scenario:

Let's say that the FA additions continue to trickle in, padding the depth on the roster. I would love something along the lines of Shelby Harris, Josh Bynes, and Tramon Williams.

As pick #30 comes up, the Colts call Gutekunst because they'd like to get into the back of round one to secure a developmental QB with a 5th year option. So the Packers move back from #30 to #34 and in return, swap picks with Indianapolis in the 3rd down (they move up from #94 to #75).

Pick #34: Jalen Reagor, WR, TCU
  • Extremely explosive (97th/98th% results in the jumps; ridiculous 1.48 10 yd split, tied with Rugg's for fastest at combine) on tape.
  • Route breaks reveal high level potential for a full tree runner, despite the simplicity of TCU's role for him.
  • Instant speed makes him a threat vertically or with the ball in his hands.
  • Built like a running back at 5'11" 206#; shows up as a weapon in the running/return game.
  • Plays the ball in the air like a big receiver.
  • Production limited by the worst QB play of any receiver in this class; PFF tracked a mere 31% of his targets as accurate passes (for reference-- Justin Jefferson's targets rated 69%).
  • Would add an instant YAC role to the offense, essential for what Petals wants to do; could grow within the context of that role into a more complete option.
  • Has struggled with focus drops at times and will do so on occasion at the next level.
  • Needs to work on his press release and his position on vertical targets.
Pick #62: Noah Igbinoghene, CB, Auburn
  • Fairly recent WR to CB convert with only two years at the position.
  • Plus athleticism and physicality for the position; has the demeanor to press and the ability to stay in phase.
  • Ball skills of a WR-- literally; INT's will come as he gets more comfortable at the position.
  • Stout run defender for the corner position.
  • Plays with a lot of confidence, which is nowhere more important than at corner.
  • Has a lot of honing to do in terms of footwork and positioning during the route.
  • Definitely a redshirt type of prospect.
  • Added ST value immediately.
Pick #75: Matt Peart, OT, Connecticut
  • "Freak" is thrown around way too much when talking about the draft, but Peart's length truly is freakish; near 37" arms (99th%).
  • Very easy mover on tape, be it in the run game or in mirroring edge rush.
  • Surprisingly adept at blocking on the move.
  • Does not yet know how to use his length; hand placement needs a lot of work.
  • Could use a year in an NFL strength and conditioning program.
  • Swing tackle in 2020 and starting RT in 2021.

We both disagree about Reagor so I'll leave it at that.

Like Igbo, just in the 3rd.

Like Peart.

Alright, I'll take a swing at 7 rounds.

Trade: Packers trade #30 to the Chargers for #37, #112, and #151.

#37: Jaylon Johnson, CB, Utah: The Packers have no depth at corner and are one off-season away from Alexander being literally the only proven guy at the position on the roster. It would be wise (and most likely financially necessary) to replace King. There is a block of skilled man cover corners with size who I would love to add, including Johnson, A.J. Terrell, and Kristian Fulton. Johnson in particular is a really strong press player who plays with great confidence. Alternatives: A.J. Terrell (CB), Kristian Fulton (CB), Jalen Reagor (WR), Brandon Aiyuk (WR).

#62: Michael Pittman, WR, USC: If the Packers don't pick a WR with their first pick, then it's going to be a long wait for #62, but I am pretty confident that a good player will be there. But because of how many candidates there are at this position, and how long the wait would be, it's really hard to project who might end up being the player to make it. In this scenario, I have Michael Pittman-- an impressive size/athleticism combination who wins in multiple ways. He can play in a few different roles, but long term he would be an X receiver for the outside. Alternatives: Laviska Shenault (WR), Damon Arnette (CB), Malik Harrison (LB), Lucas Niang (OT)

#94: Logan Wilson, LB, Wyoming: With Kirksey in house, there is a need for a player who can play a role next to him, as well as be his heir apparent as soon as 2021. Wilson is a pretty good athlete for the position who demonstrated a three down skill set, at least at the MWC level. Alternatives: Jordan Brooks (LB), Troy Pride (CB), Bryan Edwards (WR), Alex Taylor (OT)

Trade: Packers trade #112 and #151 for pick #100

#100: Alex Taylor, OT, South Carolina State: With Rick Wagner in house, the need for a starting RT isn't immediate, but depth and the future are both serious concerns. Taylor is coming up from the FCS level and needs to add mass to his frame, but he has a freakish combination of length and athleticism, and isn't as raw as some might imagine.

#136: Devin Duvernay, WR, Texas: I'd love to see the Packers double dip at WR relatively high to take advantage of the depth in this class. With the outside receiver addressed earlier, I would look for someone to work in the slot here, specifically as a YAC threat. Duvernay has great speed and is built like a RB, to run powerfully through contact. He would be a great screen weapon.

#175: Dalton Keene, TE/HB, Virginia Tech: Assuming that Petals wants to continue using a lead blocker on occasion (a safe assumption given how much he played Vitale last year), then we should expect to see a HB/FB come off the board at some point. Keene is a favorite of mine with his ability to lead block and catch the ball out of the backfield.

#192: Danny Pinter, iOL, Ball State: Pinter is an undersized, smaller school tackle who lacks the length to stick at that position in the pros. It's unclear at this point if he projects to center, guard, or both, but he has some intriguing athletic tools to work with.

#208: Carter Coughlin, ED, Minnesota: Coughlin is an undersized edge rusher with skills to drop and fill some off-ball responsibilities. However, he's severely undersized. He would be a full time special teamer with the potential to carve out a role on defense in time, doing some of the things that Fackrell was doing.

#209: Jamycal Hasty, RB, Baylor: In addition to having a back with the name "Hasty," which would be fun, I think this Baylor product is a good zone runner with good receiving skills.

#236: Kamren Curl, S, Arkansas: Curl would profile as a ST'er and a backup SS to Adrian Amos.

#242: Sean McKeon, TE, Michigan: McKeon has the frame, experience, and willingness of an in-line blocking Y tight end, but he needs at least one redshirt year to add to his frame before he's ready to deal with the NFL level.

One thing that blows my mind, and forgive me if my memory is off, but you consistently mock Johnson in the 1st Round but won't mock Kristian Fulton?

I don't think Gute will draft anybody undersized so Pinter, Coughlin, and Hasty are all off my boards. But I love Amik Robertson.

I was not aware Curl had declared, nice info. Probably should have stayed though. Did he ever make it back from that suspension?

Seems like everyone wants flyers on TEs in the 7th. I know you don't like the DL class but you gotta expect Gute to take SOMEBODY....

So my favorite scenario this year is to move down into the 30's with a team trying to get a QB in the first round, and thus secure a 5th year option.

IND (34), LAC (37), CAR (38), MIA (39), and JAX (42) could all be in that position.

The best comparison to that sort of deal is the 2018 trade up in which the Ravens took Lamar Jackson.

The Eagles gave up #32 and #132 (interestingly, this is virtually equivalent value on the chart to #30) for #52, #125, and a 2019 2nd. As you always value next year picks one round later, I am valuing that 2019 2nd as a 2018 3rd, and placing it right in the middle.

This would mean that, per the chart, the Ravens paid 627 "points" of value to get from #52 to the equivalent of #30, or 28.5 points per slot.

If that's the rate when a QB is involved, then that would put the price at:

114 for IND at #34: Pick #96/97
200 for LAC at #37: Pick #76/77
229 for CAR at #38: Pick #72/73
257 for MIA at #39: Pick #66/67
342 for JAX at #42: Pick #56

I don't know if that rate as I've figure it would actually hold up, but it is a pretty clear comp. If it did, that's quite a bit higher compensation than I was figuring on.


You stole my thunder....but to caveat on this, the Dolphins hold the keys to the kingdom. The word is they don't like Tua....does Miami wait and let teams get into a bidding war to jump up to take him? If that happens, then a bidding war starts for Love. This won't result in us getting another 1st Rounder in 2021 but it could result in us having an additional 2nd or 3rd in 2021 depending on who comes calling. It's a very fluid situation but I think it all depends on if the Dolphins let Tua twist in the wind for a little bit. Either way, both the Colts and the Chargers are going to want that 5th Year Option that they can't get in Round 2.
 

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Exactly what I said. Great receivers often require a high degree of athleticism for the position. Great tackles don't have to be elite athletes relative to other tackles. Elite athletes tend to go earlier in the draft.

Ummm....

Who's the great tackle that doesn't have a high degree of athleticism relative to the position? The majority of great tackles are very good athletes. The majority of great tackles go within the first two rounds.

There's a reason there is a lack of quality OL play in the NFL, and no lack of good WR's in the NFL. It is harder to find an elite tackle than an elite WR.
 

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Ummm....

Who's the great tackle that doesn't have a high degree of athleticism relative to the position? The majority of great tackles are very good athletes. The majority of great tackles go within the first two rounds.

There's a reason there is a lack of quality OL play in the NFL, and no lack of good WR's in the NFL. It is harder to find an elite tackle than an elite WR.

Yeah, I agree, not great oline play. How off the charts athletic were Bakhtiari, Tauscher, Clifton, or Bulaga? They were basically average (though I think Clifton was really fast in the 40?).

Julio Jones, Mike Evans, Michael Thomas, Amari Cooper, Tyreke Hill, heck, even Davante Adams was in the top third of all wide receivers drafted in broad jump, vertical jump, 3 cone, weight, and 10 yard split.

Maybe I'm jaded because the Packers and Patriots have had pretty good olines with later round picks (for the most part), but spending an early pick on a potentially elite receiver seems to make more sense to me.

Plus, I'm worried Gute will draft Isaiah Wilson and then I'll have to think he's an idiot (because some GMs apparently don't think consistency is important in oline play). I don't want to think that.
 
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Yeah, I agree, not great oline play. How off the charts athletic were Bakhtiari, Tauscher, Clifton, or Bulaga? They were basically average (though I think Clifton was really fast in the 40?).

Julio Jones, Mike Evans, Michael Thomas, Amari Cooper, Tyreke Hill, heck, even Davante Adams was in the top third of all wide receivers drafted in broad jump, vertical jump, 3 cone, weight, and 10 yard split.

Maybe I'm jaded because the Packers and Patriots have had pretty good olines with later round picks (for the most part), but spending an early pick on a potentially elite receiver seems to make more sense to me.

Plus, I'm worried Gute will draft Isaiah Wilson and then I'll have to think he's an idiot (because some GMs apparently don't think consistency is important in oline play). I don't want to think that.

I pretty thoroughly refuted this idea above...
 
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We both disagree about Reagor so I'll leave it at that.

Like Igbo, just in the 3rd.

Like Peart.

One thing that blows my mind, and forgive me if my memory is off, but you consistently mock Johnson in the 1st Round but won't mock Kristian Fulton?

I don't think Gute will draft anybody undersized so Pinter, Coughlin, and Hasty are all off my boards. But I love Amik Robertson.

I was not aware Curl had declared, nice info. Probably should have stayed though. Did he ever make it back from that suspension?

Seems like everyone wants flyers on TEs in the 7th. I know you don't like the DL class but you gotta expect Gute to take SOMEBODY....


You stole my thunder....but to caveat on this, the Dolphins hold the keys to the kingdom. The word is they don't like Tua....does Miami wait and let teams get into a bidding war to jump up to take him? If that happens, then a bidding war starts for Love. This won't result in us getting another 1st Rounder in 2021 but it could result in us having an additional 2nd or 3rd in 2021 depending on who comes calling. It's a very fluid situation but I think it all depends on if the Dolphins let Tua twist in the wind for a little bit. Either way, both the Colts and the Chargers are going to want that 5th Year Option that they can't get in Round 2.

I cannot imagine that Igbinoghene makes it to #94. His ball skills are undeveloped, but he's a great athlete with man skills, and not very many guys in this class can say that. He's also like 20 years old and has only been playing the position for two years, so it's going to be the easiest thing in the world for FO's to talk themselves into the upside.

I like Jaylon Johnson better than Kristian Fulton, however I would be happy for the Packers to take either. I've done like two mocks, so it isn't like I'm avoiding him. Johnson's history of shoulder injuries might drop him for teams and/or the Packers, but just strictly what he can do on the field, I think he's the CB3 this year.

Maybe you're right, and Gutekunst won't take a 5'8" back, but I am not convinced he would be as strict with his thresholds that late in the draft.

Curl was only suspended for one game in 2018. He played the whole season last year.

I am not sure that the Dolphins preferring Herbert to Tua would change things as radically as you're suggesting. Why would teams bidding to get up and take Tua mean that Love makes it to #30? And why would it have an effect on the bidding for Love one way or another?
 

Fredrik87

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^I don't think they dislike Tua, they just like Herbert more. 2018 Dolphins had a bunch of meetings with Herbert and Love(all info via Tony Pauline).
I would also add its possible that they do like Tua but not enough to trade up for him and are trying to drive down the interest in trading up for him from other teams such as the chargers.
 

Favre>Rodgers259

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I am not sure that the Dolphins preferring Herbert to Tua would change things as radically as you're suggesting. Why would teams bidding to get up and take Tua mean that Love makes it to #30? And why would it have an effect on the bidding for Love one way or another?

What I'm saying is, if Washington does the "unthinkable" and selects Herbert, we could have a situation. I think Miami likes Tua, but not at 5th. Maybe they let him hang out til 18th or 26th. The problem is, if they wait til 26th they give the Raiders 2 shots at him and the Patriots 1 as well. By any chance that happens, maybe they think Love is in their back pocket and take him at 26th. The further Tua falls, the more interesting things could get. If Miami selects Love instead and leaves Tua twisting in the wind, things could get REALLY interesting. Remember NFL GMs are likely in their bedrooms/offices by themselves with nobody to talk sense into them. A lot could happen, nothing could happen at all. Either way I hope Gute is taking every call.
 
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Here's a stand pat mock for the people.

30. Brandon Aiyuk, WR, ASU: I actually think Michael Pittman is a better prospect, and would love for the Packers to draft him, but YAC ability is far and away the biggest need in the receiving corps. If the Packers can't trade down and accrue extra picks, they may feel the need to take the bigger need immediately. Aiyuk is still great value. I actually prefer Reagor, but again... "for the people."

62. Terrell Burgess, DB, UTAH: I keep moving Burgess up. He's a safety and slot corner with man coverage ability, strong tackling, and is reportedly really smart. He could fit multiple roles in sub package, as a slot corner in nickel and a safety in dime. Players like this allow Pettine to disguise coverage effectively, and adding strong tacklers to the secondary will make sub packages a little stiffer against the run. If they can move down and pick up an earlier 3rd, he might be a target there. I really don't have a great feel for who will make it to #62.

94. Jack Driscoll, OT, AUB: I wish I had metrics on Driscoll, but on tape he looks like a Packer. He's just under 6'5" with 33" arms and great movement skills on tape. He's maintained a weight of 304-306 lbs this offseason. While a lack of strength shows up on tape, he was a very effective in pass pro and has the skills for zone blocking. A redshirt year to add strength is in order, but I will bet on the guy that has put on about 100 lbs of good weight, earned a bachelors degree, earned a masters degree, and started 45 games since 2015.

136. Troy Dye, LB, OR: Dye could fall behind the pack at linebacker in class due to being a little bit over-aged. He will be a 24 year old rookie. However, at the end of the 4th round, the value outweighs that downside. He has good movement skills and will be a good understudy to Kirksey for a season.

175. J. Reed, WR, UVA: Reed is a gadget weapon as a receiver and runner with YAC ability. He's quietly a plus athlete, with good results across the board at 6'0" 224 lbs. He offers value on special teams, in the quick passing game, and as a mix-up option in the running game. I like that value in the back of the 5th round.

192. J. Runyan, OL, UM: I don't know where Runyan will play at the next level, but he's a Packer (so is Pinter, but I'm just mixing it up here). 6'4", 306 lbs, 7.57 3C, 4.69 SS, and a college left tackle. Try him at guard or center and see what happens.

208. D. Keene, TE, VTU: Keene is more of an H-back than a true in line TE, but that's fine because the Packers need to replace Vitale. He's not anything special in terms of production, but he's a good athlete and a willing blocker.

209. E. Weaver, LB, CAL: Weaver is a run plugger at LB. Athletically, he is as much of a Blake Martinez clone as you'll be likely to fine. He's ST help and could carve out a role in base defense like what Goodson held last year.

236. J. Penisini, iDL, UTAH: Penisini is just an early down plug. He could be immediately competition for Lancaster. The people want to see an iDL.

242. M. Harper, CB, SIU: Harper is going to be a fun project at cornerback for someone. His pro day numbers are pretty freaky for a 6'2" 196 lb corner.
 

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Exactly what I said. Great receivers often require a high degree of athleticism for the position. Great tackles don't have to be elite athletes relative to other tackles. Elite athletes tend to go earlier in the draft.

I think a OL has to be athletic for his size to be an NFL tackle. How many collegiate tackles end up as guards?
 

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