Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by ivo610, May 18, 2012.
So Brett wouldnt have tossed 6 ints in the Rams playoff game then?
Check your post Jack. I think you got the decades mixed up.
Even Ted couldnt have stopped brett throwing pick 6s in the postseason
I should prob look at the rest of the posts next time b4 I respond lol.
Great minds think alike
Brett Favre was a great QB. I think Aaron Rodgers is going to leave more of a legacy in Green Bay.
Brett Favre is wirhout any doubt a first ballot hall of famer and he has the credentials to have his number retired. However, having his number retired is the decision of Green Bay Packers and there is a lot of bad blood there. If Pack doesn't retire his number then that is their choice and I don't think anyone can blame them.
Yep, "'95" should've been "2005".
To all of you who DON'T want to retire Brett's number: wake up and smell the coffee. This isn't high school football. Professional football players sign a contract. But that contract isn't a lifetime allegiance to a franchise.
Evidence: P. Manning. This is a business deal. Like all deals when the time is up to end it, it ends, whether both parties want it or just one party. Brett DIDN'T want to leave Green Bay, so he got bitter. He thought he could play a few more years and realized at the time, Minnesota was loaded with talent and would contend for the Super Bowl. That's the NFL. It only was bitter because he played for the Vikings. If he stayed with the Jets, none of this would have happened. By reading your posts it appears many of you suffer from the same problem as Brett: bitterness that won't end.
Lets get over it!
Celebrate the fact that he was one of the NFL's all-time greats, playing in Green Bay, and we were lucky to have him all those years.
He will be a first ballot Hall of Fame inductee in 2015. That summer he will be placed in the NFL Hall of Fame. At the Packers first home game that September, he should have his number retired and later put in the Packers Hall of Fame.
Time to grow up folks. There was no one who dispised Brett more for what he did than me. I realized my mistake and grew up.
I guess I don't really care either way. If he wanted to retire as a Falcon, Jet or a Viking doesn't really matter to me. Has he signed papers yet? Who knows he may come out of retirement.............again.
It has nothing to do with "growing up" net. Just because Favre's number will be retired doesn't mean some of us have to like it. And there is nothing immature about expressing that opinion. It's my opinion the mess from 2008 on was ALL on Favre. He wasn't forced to retire and when he changed his mind about a month later the Packers were ready to welcome him back. Then he changed his mind again and stayed retired. Then he changed his mind AGAIN. He thought he was bigger than the best franchise in the league. Thank goodness Thompson and McCarthy said, 'Enough is enough!' And rather than just accepting the trade to the Jets (if all he wanted to do was play, why not stay there?), Favre betrayed the team that made him rich and famous. He was revealed to be a selfish, immature, lying pervert. And his immaturity continues as he won't have anything to do with the Packers as long as Thompson is GM. Embrace him if you like but keep in mind as a Packers fan he isn't embracing you. IMO your pretence of maturity rings hollow: It's not immature to remember Favre's actions.
I have aleays felt that retiring a players number goes beyond his statistics and even accomplishments. The pkayers relationship with the organization and fans has a lot to do with it. There is no argument as to Brett Favres place in Hall of Fame as well as his accomplishments. However, I think that if Green Bay were to consider retiring his number then I think that fractured relationship needs to be mended first and I don't see that happenning. Green Bay Packers organization bent over backwards to accomodate him and basically spit in their faces when he did what he did. I remember the situation when Joe Montana left San Francisco 49ers and went to Kansas City Chiefs. I remember when Kurt Warner went to Arizona. Both of them were successful with their new teams and retired with class and dignity. It is unfortunate that Brett Farve didn't go out like those two fellas.
Jack and Mikey have it right.
Why do teams retire numbers? To memorialize a player because his status as a member of the organization has reached some level.
The problem with Brett is not that he played for another team - Lombardi and Reggie went to other teams and their reputations were still iconic. The problem is that he spit in our faces. He pissed on Greenbay, the Packers, and on all Packer fans. With that kind of attitude, why in the hell would you like to honor him? He roots against the Packers. He tried everything in his power to undermine the team. This goes way beyond playing for an enemy. There are no statues of Benedict Arnold glorifying his excellent military career prior to trying to turn over West Point to the enemies.*
In recent times he has softened his stance in the press. What else is he going to do? Minny fans despise him for throwing away their best chance at a SB in decades. Jets fans never really warmed to him. All he has left is to try and undo all the wrong he has done to the Packers.
I was a big Favre fan. I liked his effort and his humble attitude. But wake up and smell the coffee - the true Brett revealed himself in a big way. I think Jacks' adjectives pretty much sum it up for me also. Brett is no kind of man who deserves any recognition from this long and proud franchise.
*ThnxJackVainisi attributed with first making this analogy
I agree Jack however the facts are he will be recognized by The Packer someday. IMO The Packers are waiting for Farve to soften his stand on the matter. It maybe a few years.
I've tried so hard not to comment...but obviously have been "liking" and "disagreeing" certain posts....
No truer words were ever posted ThxJackV!!! also thumbs up to Amishmafia and Mike! If I had any energy left to expend on the topic.... it would of been summed up in these 3 posts!!
No matter what, noone else should wear the number 4 as a Packer.
Sure his jersey should be retired. But what always bothered me is that he knew this was coming down the road. His arrogance kept this team in limbo year after year. He probably has the biggest ego of anyone that has every put on a uniform. We had a franchise quarterback in waiting and we made the right decision. Players change teams all the time, even great one's like Montana, but he did it with class and was thankful for the organization that cultivated his NFL career and legacy.
I rest my case about maturity. It has everything to do with maturity. Favre needs to grow up, and so do the fans.
I remember his actions as well as you do, but does hating for life advance your life or merely put you in with the folks who can't move on?
I'll extend it more: I'm old enough to remember the Bart Starr coaching era in Green Bay. I'm also old enough to remember Bart Starr the football player. I was in the press room the day Starr was named coach of the Packers.
Bart Starr, the QB, to me, is still the best QB the Packers have produced to date. Aaron is likely to surpass him, but Bart has 5 NFL championships, and 2 Super Bowl MVP's. No one has surpassed those marks, the only real mark that matters if you understand football. (The rest is just for fantasy football freaks).
Bart Starr the Coach and GM was a near-total disaster. His record speaks for itself.
I was one of the people at Lambeau booing my guts out at Bart Starr the coach and how dumb some of teams played.(Great offense, no defense).
I think it was sometime in the late 80's or early 90's, the Packers honored one of the late '60's championship teams and, of course, Bart was part of it and said he would be there. When the Packers fired Starr, he was very bitter. He felt the team was only another season away from winning, but regardless, he was fired. So there were many years when there was a strain between the Packers and one of their all-time greats. It took several years before Bart was welcomed back to Green Bay.
Fast-forward to the day the Super Bowl team was honored. I was fearing, deeply fearing, the fans would boo their guts out at Starr the coach and ruin the day. But the fans matured. When Bart was introduced, there was a standing ovation. Time had healed the wounds.
The same is true with Favre. That is what maturity is. You understand the problem, but realize that nothing good is going to result from holding a grudge. Brett will also realize one day holding a grudge is pointless.
I'm older than probably 95% of you here, and trust me, holding a grudge is pointless.
And that is why I ask the fans, like they did with Bart Starr, to grow up and move on.[/quote]
[/quote]I totally agree. Also when one holds a grudge it doesn't hurt the other person. Only the one holding the grudge. It affects you physically as well. That sounds weird but you hold a grudge long enough & people have been known to have a great amout of stress in their life & after awhile it takes a toll on your body.
I haven’t been posting on this site long. In the first post I posted on Favre in May of last year, I wrote: “First, I for one don't hate Favre. I honestly don’t care enough about him to hate him.”
I am quoting my own post only to provide evidence that I don’t hate Favre and am not saying so only in response to the above post. Holding a grudge is only damaging IMO if it is an obsession, only if it eats at the person holding the grudge. I can’t speak for others, but that certainly doesn’t describe me. Look at my posts here – while I have been adamant about how I feel about Favre, I’ve never started a thread on him or introduced the subject on a thread. Except when the subject of Favre comes up, I never think about him.
I’m also older than most posting here – I became a young Packers fan just before Lombardi arrived (because I was born and raised in Wisconsin and because my father was a Packers fan). As I grew up, football was the sport I was best at and that probably had something to do with my remaining a fanatical Packers fan throughout the “dark ages” from Lombardi to Wolf. So I too remember Starr as the best QB in Packers history and as a HC who wasn’t ready for the job. I agree with Bart that at the time of his firing he was getting better at the job.
By bringing up Starr you show your misunderstanding of the topic at hand. Certainly Starr was disappointed in being fired. But even those who view his time as HC as an utter failure can’t legitimately claim he attempted to sabotage the franchise. I don’t know of a single Packers fan who alleges Starr wasn’t attempting to do his very best for the franchise. Never – not once – did he utter a negative word about the Packers franchise. Never once did he root for Packers’ opponents. Never once did he disgrace himself. He was and remains the epitome of dignity and class. Without question Bart Starr deserves to receive the highest honor the franchise can bestow. The same cannot be said about Favre so for a lot of us, even those of us who believe he deserves a place in both HOFs, he does not deserve the highest honor. The contrast between the two men as human beings and regarding their actions vis a vis the Packers organization could hardly be more stark. What a bad example for your point of view!
Finally one characteristic of a mature person is accepting that others can hold opinions contrary to one’s own; that many times there are legitimate points on both sides of an issue. net’s insistence that all Packers fans agree with him on this issue and his “resting his case” have a quality of immaturity. Is holding his breath until everyone agrees next?
I don't know about "hating" Favre but after four pages on this topic, I think it's fair to say that some folks are pretty emotionally invested in the subject...
And I respect you for that. I too don't bring up Favre. I don't start threads about him and I don't take every opportunity to bash him as some do here. As I have said in previous posts I cheered for him when he played and jeered him when he left. Grudges can consume you. I'm about what is going on now.
As a youngster dad liked hunting as a sport. He didn't watch, listen to or follow organized sports. But it was one heck of a big deal that a Wisconsin sports team was world champions. I have followed the Packers since the glory years and through the dark ages. What does maturity have to do with an opinion or a stance on a player.
You people who think grudges consume you have the most to worry about. I don't think about Favre at all unless it's brought up in conversation or in dialogue in these forums. I have not wasted an iota of energy on hating on the man. I do however have an opinion.
Listen please.... Starr may have been bitter but I don't know of a single fan who was ever bitter at Starr. Lombardi left but never disgraced himself or the Packer organization. Same with Reggie. The real difference here is the character of the man named Favre. He intentionally attacked the Packer organization and it's fans. Now if you want to use examples to show me how I should be mature, please trot out an example of a player who did the same as Brett towards the Packers.
It's like you're comparing a traffic ticket to rape. They are both against the law but one is far more serious. How you can equate this with maturity is beyond me. Even younger fans will always remember how Favre spit in the face of the franchise and it's fans. I think what you are experiencing is memory loss, not maturity.
Favre wasn't the only player to break the rules or be disobediant. Other Packer greats weren't perfect either but their # is retired. Should we unretire their #. No of course not. Favre may've left the org. on a bad note but in case you haven't relized,the NFL is a business. By retiring Favre's #4 we can make money off his name & #.
Favre will have to agree to this first. May take a few years.
'Round and round it goes, where it stops no one ...'. Who am I kidding, it will never stop.
Separate names with a comma.