The Packers biggest loss of the offseason is.....

1)not Wahle
2)not Rivera
3)not Sharper

I think it's.....

Doug Pederson.

Here's why: Doug was washed up as a backup QB, as his stint filling in for Brett last year showed. He was Brett's closest confidant on the team(and hunting buddy), but that still isn't the biggest reason....

his ability to hold for Longwell.

Davis, Pederson and Longwell have made it look so easy for so long(well) that most of us have forgotten what "wide right" is.

Longwell clearly was ill-at-ease with Nall, etc. Bryan Barker did an admirable job filling in.

Keep in mind both Minnesota victories last year were by last second kicks.
"Wide right" would have meant a possible 8-8 year.

NET! I think you gone crazy. :-? I know that holding the seams out on a football is instrumental on the kick, but to say that he's a bigger loss than Whale or Rivera or even Sharper is loco. It really comes down to the kicker. Just about anyone with an opposable thumb can catch and spin the ball.

NEt-

Don't forget Pederson was out for at least half of last season. I think on field adjustments have been made.

Now personal adjustments may be another story. I hope though - that maybe if Favre doesn't hang around (I say this with complete respect) the geriatic players, he will continue to feel and play young. He will stay motivated....

Enoughj of the losses, who was the biggest GAIN of the offseason?

Obviously Bates and TT are the biggest gains to the Pack.

As for players I can't say there has been a gain.

After reading Sharper's comments about the Vikings, I agree he wasn't a loss at all. I live in MN. near the WI/MN border and get the Duluth paper. Sharper implies that the Vikings are a much better team than the Packers, and he is just thrilled to be wearing purple. I do think that Rivera and Wahle were a big loss.

I think Terrance Murphy will make the biggest splash of the 2005 draft for the Packers this upcoming season. Rodgers may be the answer for Favre's successor (and I stress the may). If things go as planned, the Packers should relieve Fergy of some of his ST duties and allow him to flourish as a receiver because I think most will agree that he's got the ability. Murphy looks the part and I hope it carries over to the field when it counts.

it annoys me, why our top recievers do so much time on special teams. The top four recievers shouldn't see special teams time. Notice how thin our recivers ended up being during the playoffs last year.

Biggest offseason loss--Javon Walker, right now he's a loss because he's not officially a Packer yet, biggest offensive playmaker we've seen in a while, we need him back for this offense to be great again.

I hear you. Javon needs to be in camp and work out an extension in mid-season once he's put together at least half of another great year! ST takes a toll and it really showed in the Minny playoff game. Andrae Thurman was out there running routes with Antonio Chatman. That doesn't sound real good in a game of that magnitude considering the horses we have in that stable. Like I said, I agree with you 100%, let Fergy get out on some routes and turn into the receiver we know he can be. With the addition of Bragg and Murphy, we may have something there.

Bragg has the makings of being a solid special teamer, whether it be as a gunner on punts or even as a return man, I think he will be the guy to finally remove Ferguson from his special teams duties

Hope so, I sure like the combination of Walker, Driver, Fergy, and Murphy on the field at the same time. Heck, if Chatman is our fifth receiver, I would say our WR corps is looking pretty good. Now we need the line to gel after losing two key cogs. Flanagan has already said that the line won't take a step backward. We'll see.

Net, do we have to remind you to take your medicine like we did on the other forum. It will make the little animals and other delusions go away :lol:

LMAO.....that's funny!

I think Sharper has to be considered a big loss right now considering the state of our secondary. Once again, we have to wait and see if guys like Collins, Underwood, Little, Freeman, etc. can bring something to the table before we truly can assess how big a loss #42 was. Personally, I won't miss his ego-driven comments all the time while watching him come up short in the tackling dept. over and over. If some young player does the same thing but keeps his mouth shut and doesn't tell everyone that he's the greatest while trying to give 100%, it may seem easier to swallow - at least for a while!

Vikings can have him then, the turncoat. uke:

Sharper is the most overrated pile of sh!t ever! (next to Derek Jeter)

Yet the Packers have no one better to replace him. By the way, Bruce Springsteen is the most overrated pile of sh!t ever!

Sharper showd how much the Pack needed him the last two season when his stats dropped through the floor! Some would say its' because he couldn't play his game because of the limited talent around him, but if you spent some time watching him this last season..he was out of position on plays he used to make on a regular basis. Too bad he has to flap his mouth when he has nothing to back it up!

I usually agree with Net, but this one I disagree with him. When Pederson went down, Barker came in and did as well if not better at holding the ball for Longwell. Barker's hold helped save the game in the win against Houston, where the snap was wide and bounced since it was a short snap, yet Barker was able to snatch it as Longwell kicked the winning field goal in the final minute.

In my opinion the only real loss was Wahle. He is just entering his prime years and is a very good player who could still get even better. He had a little bit of a nasty streak that I liked too that I think our O-line might miss a little.

I think Sharper is on the decline, misses too many tackles, and I got tired of his mouth the last few years. So I wasn't sorry to see him go.

I was sorry to see Rivera go, as he gave us his all when he was here. But I don't think it's a big loss because he's also on the decline. He injured his back that needed surgery in the offseason, so who knows how much more his body has to give.

If we were losing the Sharper and Rivera of 3 years ago I would say it's a big loss, but I think we let them go at a good time before they break down even more physically.

Sharper's play dropped off along with the rest of the defense the last couple years. I think it's difficult to evaluate this past season for the safeties since the coaches kept changing things on the players. The players second guessed themselves and ended up out of position a lot. I hope to see a lot more from Roman this year, who has the talent to do very well under Bates.

Don't forget that a few years ago Wahle was going to be a backup since he couldn't make it at LT. Then he was moved to guard and his play improved each season. He's a great guard, but he can't play tackle and shouldn't get the same money as a LT.

Rivera has been a steady workhorse, but his offseason injury just shows that he may have needed to step down this season anyway. Guard is the easiest position to replace on the OL and we've got good players to move in.

Pederson's contribution to the team that will be missed is his relationship with Favre more than anything else. We should have been hiring him onto the coaching staff. As for being the holder, I'm not worried yet. Both Nall and Sander are gaining experience, but neither is doing it in the bad weather yet.

As for the biggest loss, I think I'd have to go with Franks right now. Walker has only missed a volunteer camp and a minicamp, but he doesn't want to hold-out. Franks still is unsigned. Steele is doing ok, but he's still dropping passes all the time in the minicamps. Martin just can't fill-in, that's obvious. McHugh may be able to fill into Franks best skills, as a blocker for the running game.

I believe that it would be a bit easier to learn how to catch and hold a ball for a kicker, than blocking and creating hoiles vs 275lbs men, IMHO. :shock: Biggest loss and imapct is JW holding out and Hunt no showing when he could be absorbing Bates's new system. I also would have liked to see BF in at least 2 days of OTA so that the likes of T-Murph and others can see if they can catch one from our starter, plus see if our whole new DB's can defend a NFL QB starters throw. I hope MS's plan to rest BF, and allow the family time works well but, it would have been a better guage on these new folks to have him there.

Your point about experience for the young guys against Brett would have been good, but it's obvious that resting Favre is the best thing for the team. Brett is now so ready to go that he's watching NFLE and he's been working out with a personal trainer for the first time.

All indications are that Brett's going to come into camp feeling young and ready to play and have fun. Favre having fun on the field is great news for the Packers and bad news for the rest of the league!

The added benefit is that Rogers has gotten more reps, which are critical while he's just being introduced to the offense.