Taylor Mays-another Rouse?

[JBlood]

Thursday, April 1, 2010

USC safety Mays fails to impress in workout

Pete Dougherty is covering the road to the NFL draft for the Press-Gazette. Check the Insiders Blog every weekday for updates.

Taylor Mays' Pro Day workout Wednesday apparently left at least some NFL scouts still wary about the USC safety as a first-round draft pick despite his incredible combination of size and speed.

The Packers no doubt have looked hard into Mays as a candidate for the No. 23 pick overall, especially considering their need at safety. The question is whether he can cover well enough to play safety in the NFL or at least warrant being selected that high.

A report by SI.com panned Mays' performance in position drills at the USC campus Wednesday. It said he "looked very robotic, uneasy and off-balance while breaking to the ball. He struggled changing direction at full speed and was asked to repeat drills on a few occasions."

At the NFL scouting combine, Mays measured in at 6-feet-3 1/8 and 230 pounds, which is huge for a safety, and according to the official combine master list released to teams was timed as fast as 4.31 seconds in the 40-yard dash. That's an incredible combination of size and speed for the position.

However, there are serious questions about Mays' ability to cover and play the ball --he had only five interceptions as a four-year starter. Some teams are concerned he's another Roy Williams, who was the No. 8 pick overall by Dallas in the 1992 draft who now plays for Cleveland and has been a major disappointment because of his limitations in coverage.

Some teams figure to be looking at Mays as a WILL linebacker for a 4-3 scheme. Anyone drafting him as a safety will have to use him predominanty in the box, though at times he'd have to play deep no matter the scheme.

-- Pete Dougherty, [email protected]

 

[ivo610]

As i have said before, if his coach passes on him twice there should be concerns.

 

[PackersRS]

I've made this comparison before, and completely agree.

Right now, he's Aaron Rouse the 2nd. Tons of physical ability, ZERO ball awareness.

He does, however, have much better intangibles than Rouse, so he might develop into something better.

But I don't know how you teach a guy awareness. He looks lost on the field...

 

[OldSchoolFan]

I see this guy blow people up, and in my opinion, you just can't coach that...as a safety, your coverage skills are secondary to your hitting skills...think John Lynch, Ronnie Lott.Even old "busted nose " Chuck Cecil was not a great coverage guy. IMHO, these guys are there to "bring the wood" and Taylor does it " with extreme prejudice."

 

[ThinkICare]

Mays is a much better prospect then Rouse was. Going by the workouts, should Bruce Campbell be picked 1st overall? Workouts aren't the end all be all for draft prospects.

 

[JBlood]

ThinkICare: "Workouts aren't the end all be all for draft prospects."

Agreed. I haven't seen him play, maybe he'll make a good strong safety, or linebacker. It would be interesting to have Kevin Greene work with him.

 

[NYPacker]

Take a look at this article: Polamalu comparisons could lift USC's Mays - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

In summary, it's making a comparison to Polamalu's play in his last year as compared to Mays. Like Mays, Polamalu was criticized tremendously in his senior year at USC. He only had one interception to his name after years of being a playmaker. Mays falls into the same category. Will Mays be the next Troy Polamalu? I'm not sure exactly but all the ingredients are definitely there.

 

[PackersRS]

Take a look at this article: Polamalu comparisons could lift USC's Mays - NFL - Yahoo! Sports

In summary, it's making a comparison to Polamalu's play in his last year as compared to Mays. Like Mays, Polamalu was criticized tremendously in his senior year at USC. He only had one interception to his name after years of being a playmaker. Mays falls into the same category. Will Mays be the next Troy Polamalu? I'm not sure exactly but all the ingredients are definitely there.

That's just untrue.

As a 3 year starter, Polamalu had 6 ints (3 returned to td), 13 pass deflections, 2 fumble recoveries and 4 punt blocks. 278 tackles in 3 years.

Mays had 4 years as a starter, 5 ints, never returned an int, never made a sack, never blocked a punt, only forced one fumble, and that's it. He had 268 tackles in 4 years.

Comparing him to Polamalu is a tremenduous reach. Mays does not falls into "playmaker" category.

 

[NYPacker]

That's just untrue.

As a 3 year starter, Polamalu had 6 ints (3 returned to td), 13 pass deflections, 2 fumble recoveries and 4 punt blocks. 278 tackles in 3 years.

Mays had 4 years as a starter, 5 ints, never returned an int, never made a sack, never blocked a punt, only forced one fumble, and that's it. He had 268 tackles in 4 years.

Comparing him to Polamalu is a tremenduous reach. Mays does not falls into "playmaker" category.

It's only speculation based on what I read on the article. Mays has potential but I'm not really a strong believer.

 

[PackersRS]

University Of Southern California Official Athletic Site
University Of Southern California Official Athletic Site

Forgot to mention that Polamalu had 28 tackles for loss.

Mays? 2...

 

[PackersRS]

It's only speculation based on what I read on the article. Mays has potential but I'm not really a strong believer.

I'm just saying, his fame of hard hitter got him so hyped, that it overcame his actual play and production.

His play and production is of a 4th rounder. But when you look at how hard he hits (WHEN he hits, and not whiffs), and his measurables, he's made something he's not...

 

[Sunshine885500]

Personally I like what Mays brings to the table. With his combination of Size & Speed in the right system he could develop into an All-Pro type of player. Too many times people base a players college career on what kind of Pro he will be. Again in the 3-4 Defense the Safety is the main focal point. If he has the size of Mays and can support on the run, cover sideline to sideline and bring on the blitz and have the speed to get there then you can make that guy into something special. Maybe USC didn't run the attacking style of defense especially this past offseason because of all of the talent they lost off of their defense. If Mays came out last year how many people felt that he would be a top pick based on the USC defense. Mays looked like a more high profile player then Mathews in the USC defense. Mathews only started one year and look at how he turned out. Now they have an off year and everything was his problem. I believe that Mays will make a special player SS in a 3-4 defense. Especially one coached by Dom Capers.

 

[ivo610]

People are very split on Mays just like they are Tebow. I wouldnt go near either but thats just me...

 

[Sunshine885500]

Here's the latest Rumor from today 4/3/10 on ESPN Insiders:


Mays a match for the Pack?
11:09
AM ET
Green Bay Packers Top Email

One of the tricky things about figuring out what player is going to be drafted by each NFL team is that many teams -- especially contending ones -- will take the "best player available" instead of necessarily drafting to their needs. On the other hand, sometimes that "best player available" will match up with a need.

Such could be the case when the Green Bay Packers are on the clock at No. 23. The Packers have a bit of a need at safety, and have "no doubt looked hard" at USC's Taylor Mays, according to Pete Dougherty of the Green Bay Press-Gazette. Mays is a bit of an enigma: he's got linebacker size and blazing speed, but has appeared stiff at times, and has questionable coverage skills. The last thing a team needs on the safety level is someone who will be unable to act as a safety valve. Dougherty mentions that some teams are even scouting Mays as a WILL linebacker.

Here's what Steve Muench of Scouts, Inc. had to say about Mays following USC's pro day this week:


Insider Draft Blog
Mays continues to mystify
"The fact that Mays did not run the 40-yard dash at USC's pro day on Wednesday might have disappointed fans but it makes sense. He blazed a time of 4.31 seconds at the NFL combine and covers a lot of ground on film, so the bigger priority was showing that concerns over his stiff hips in coverage are exaggerated. However, Mays didn't look fluid or comfortable changing directions during position drills. He still projects as a first-round pick because there will likely be at least one team that falls in love with his size/speed combination enough to take him on Day 1."

 

[PackersRS]

Exactly. His worst aspect is coverage, and what we need most is a player that can either cover or rush the passer. We don't need someone who can support the run, or hold the point of attack. We already have that, our rush D is #1 in the league.

How exactly Mays would've helped against AZ? He IMHO would've made things ever worse.

Like someone in here said, Seattle needs secondary help badly. They have 2 picks in the 1st round. If his own coach (Pete Carroll) passes on him twice, then there's something wrong with him...

 

[NYPacker]

Exactly. His worst aspect is coverage, and what we need most is a player that can either cover or rush the passer. We don't need someone who can support the run, or hold the point of attack. We already have that, our rush D is #1 in the league.

How exactly Mays would've helped against AZ? He IMHO would've made things ever worse.

Like someone in here said, Seattle needs secondary help badly. They have 2 picks in the 1st round. If his own coach (Pete Carroll) passes on him twice, then there's something wrong with him...

Carroll not taking Mays more than once should open up some red flags. However does this argument not hold true for Charles Brown too? LT is more of a pressing need for the Hawks and if Brown is passed over twice he could also be a question. I think there are better LT prospects better than Brown which is why Carroll would bypass him but I think it's still a bit of a curiosity too.

 

[PackersRS]

Carroll not taking Mays more than once should open up some red flags. However does this argument not hold true for Charles Brown too? LT is more of a pressing need for the Hawks and if Brown is passed over twice he could also be a question. I think there are better LT prospects better than Brown which is why Carroll would bypass him but I think it's still a bit of a curiosity too.

Not the same rating of players.

Mays was allways considered an elite S. Not the same thing with Brown, who was allways considered a project...

 

[Sunshine885500]

I don't think what Pete Carroll does should have anything to do with whether or not GB should or should not draft a player. You guys seem to forget even though he was a great college recruiter & coach isn't he the same person who sat Clay Mathews on the bench his first 3 seasons at USC? Let me know if I'm wrong or not but Mathews was one of the best rookies in the NFL last year. Guys will project into better Pros because of the system they are projected to go into and how they will be used within that system. The system GB plays on defense is way different then the one they played at USC. That is like saying Everson Griffin will not be a good pro because of the way he played at USC and no one knows that right now.

 

[JBlood]

I don't think what Pete Carroll does should have anything to do with whether or not GB should or should not draft a player. You guys seem to forget even though he was a great college recruiter & coach isn't he the same person who sat Clay Mathews on the bench his first 3 seasons at USC? Let me know if I'm wrong or not but Mathews was one of the best rookies in the NFL last year. Guys will project into better Pros because of the system they are projected to go into and how they will be used within that system. The system GB plays on defense is way different then the one they played at USC. That is like saying Everson Griffin will not be a good pro because of the way he played at USC and no one knows that right now.

Maybe that's why he has been a complete failure in the NFL as Head Coach. I'll be surprised if he does much in Seattle.

 

[PackersRS]

I don't think what Pete Carroll does should have anything to do with whether or not GB should or should not draft a player. You guys seem to forget even though he was a great college recruiter & coach isn't he the same person who sat Clay Mathews on the bench his first 3 seasons at USC? Let me know if I'm wrong or not but Mathews was one of the best rookies in the NFL last year. Guys will project into better Pros because of the system they are projected to go into and how they will be used within that system. The system GB plays on defense is way different then the one they played at USC. That is like saying Everson Griffin will not be a good pro because of the way he played at USC and no one knows that right now.

CM3 was a walk on who weighted less than 210 pounds... I don't think you can put that on Carroll.

When CM3 got big enough, he was a starter...

About Griffin, lack of effort in college is a HUGE red flag.

 

[ThinkICare]

RS, you really think if Caroll passes on one of his "guys" twice, that there has to be something wrong with him? It couldn't just be that he wants to address different positions?

 

[PackersRS]

RS, you really think if Caroll passes on one of his "guys" twice, that there has to be something wrong with him? It couldn't just be that he wants to address different positions?

Coupled with the fact that the Seahawks have a huge need in the secondary, that this guy was supposed to be the next Troy Polamalu, and that there are HUGE concerns about his lack of playmaking and ballhawking skills, and stiif-as-wood hips and change of direction ability...

Yeah.

If he had such potential, his own coach would take him with one of two first round picks.

If you had 2 chances of picking Troy Polamalu, you would, right?

 

[ivo610]

I don't think what Pete Carroll does should have anything to do with whether or not GB should or should not draft a player. You guys seem to forget even though he was a great college recruiter & coach isn't he the same person who sat Clay Mathews on the bench his first 3 seasons at USC? Let me know if I'm wrong or not but Mathews was one of the best rookies in the NFL last year. Guys will project into better Pros because of the system they are projected to go into and how they will be used within that system. The system GB plays on defense is way different then the one they played at USC. That is like saying Everson Griffin will not be a good pro because of the way he played at USC and no one knows that right now.

Yeah, Pete Carroll is an idiot for sitting a 180 pound walk on linebacker that his own father wouldnt even start in high school. Its not like they had any talent at linebacker to begin with over at USC.

 

[ThinkICare]

Coupled with the fact that the Seahawks have a huge need in the secondary, that this guy was supposed to be the next Troy Polamalu, and that there are HUGE concerns about his lack of playmaking and ballhawking skills, and stiif-as-wood hips and change of direction ability...

Yeah.

If he had such potential, his own coach would take him with one of two first round picks.

If you had 2 chances of picking Troy Polamalu, you would, right?

Who's been saying he's the next Polamalu? I know there's some hype on the guy because of his size and his athletic ability, but I think Carroll is smart enough to look over all the prospects and not just go for his "guy" right away. Like the other person said in this thread. They should go after Charles Brown too just based off the fact that he played under Carroll. It's not like the Seahawks are set at OT either, so I don't understand why you'd poo-poo that. It seems like the consensus on Brown is that he's a late 1st rounder, along with Mays too. From what I've seen. I just don't understand your reasoning.

 

[ivo610]

Who's been saying he's the next Polamalu? I know there's some hype on the guy because of his size and his athletic ability, but I think Carroll is smart enough to look over all the prospects and not just go for his "guy" right away. Like the other person said in this thread. They should go after Charles Brown too just based off the fact that he played under Carroll. It's not like the Seahawks are set at OT either, so I don't understand why you'd poo-poo that. It seems like the consensus on Brown is that he's a late 1st rounder, along with Mays too. From what I've seen. I just don't understand your reasoning.

If you go back to the first page of the thread I believe its the 7th post that says he might be the next Polamula.

I cant think of anything the Seahawks dont need at this point but being 30th in pass defense is clearly a problem. I would have to think if you coached a player for 4 years you would come away with a pretty good idea if he is a first round talent or not. And then why would you take the risk of drafting another player at that position if your not sure on him, when you have a player you know. If Pete thinks he is a first round talent I dont know how he doesnt take him with the 2nd 1st round pick. Less than 1/2 the players drafted in the first round deserve to be drafted in the first round, so if your sure on someone being worth the pick you take him.

This is an interesting situation for Pete.