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Nick Perry

Discussion in 'Packer Fan Forum' started by NelsonsLongCatch, Feb 22, 2014.

  1. NelsonsLongCatch
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    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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  2. Einstein McFly
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    So is this how he'd line up in nickle with one other down lineman or is it a more general spot for him? I haven't heard that term before...
  3. FrankRizzo
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    I don't care where the guy plays, as long as he plays.... and isn't in the trainers room or on the sideline injured.
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  4. NelsonsLongCatch
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    NelsonsLongCatch Cheesehead

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    That's a great question... And I honestly have no idea. The Packer play so little base 3-4 defense that this could be a nickle idea or a permanent idea.
  5. Ace
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    Ok so I'm a little confused... Dom toyed with it, they implemented it, but never used it? I understand there were injuries and such but why wasn't this used when Perry wasn't injured?
  6. Pack-12
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    Sounds like what the Ravens do with Suggs
  7. HardRightEdge
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    This has been kicked around for a couple of years since we started drafting guys who look like 4-3 D-Linemen. For instance:

    http://www.packernet.com/blog/2012/...er/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

    We'd need further clarification regarding this specific implementation, but it sounds like it would be very similar to our nickel front but with Perry having his hand in the dirt, backed by 3 LBs (besides Perry and Matthews)...alternatively you could think of it as a 4-3 set with Matthews as a stand-up DE, if you will. Whether they intend to use this in a nickel set instead of or in addition to the "4-3 Under", as some call it, remains to be seen...but at this point it starts to become semantics as noted in the above link. Whether there's a third LB or a DB coming up in or near the box (as Woodson often played) is six of one, half dozen of another.

    There's seems to be a key difference between what's described in the link above and what Demovsky suggests. The description in the link (and the Haley example among others) has the elephant on the weak side...the guys who have played this position are usually the best edge rusher, moving around for a one-on-one match up. Demovsky suggests Perry-as-elephant will play strong side (between the OT and TE) rather than weak side, though I'm wondering if he was just illustrating the 7 technique.

    If it maximizes Perry's pass rush ability I'm all for it...this should be his natural position. As for the "3" in this 4-3- style D, it will be interesting to see who they use...Hawk, Jones, ?.

    I see this as a wrinkle, not a substitute for the standard 3-4 base D...the kind of think they'd use to exploit (or defend) specific match ups...maybe a bunch some games and little or none in others. Given the personnel we've got, you'd think this alignment will be put on a long leash...that is, given every opportunity to succeed even if at first it doesn't look very good.
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2014
  8. Stevie DK
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    The Patriots played with the "Elephant", that was under Bill B so they probably still have a scheme for one.
  9. Stevie DK
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  10. ExpatPacker
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    They'll use the guy they draft. Rumor has it that Kyle Van Noy is getting a good look from the Packers. A Pryor/Van Noy draft for rounds 1 and 2 would promise a nice upgrade to this defense.
  11. Poppa San
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    Poppa San Pray daily and take the plunge for Eli Staff Member Moderator

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    Assuming last seasons personnel: Since this looks to be a pass rush alignment I'd venture a guess that the LBs would probably be CM3 and Jones with one of the H backs (Heyward/Hyde/House) being the third LB covering the TE/RB.
  12. rodell330
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    Mario Williams toys with that in Buffalo..watch him,, its not really a gimmick defense but you cant have stiffs on the dline. Which is why Pickett prolly wont be at DT. You're looking for more of a gap penetration vs tying up blockers. Dont be shocked if Raji is back at NT next yr
  13. NelsonsLongCatch
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    I'm looking forward to the Packers using whatever means possible to have the best four, five or six pass rushers on the field on third down. I find it a little refreshing that the coaching staff is actively trying to maximize the talent of the players they have under contract. Perry was a defensive end in college and might never make the full transition to outside linebacker. Maximize his potential as an "elephant end".
  14. HardRightEdge
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    I'd assume Matthews would be part of the "4", not the "3", in this 4-3 variant.

    If they run it more as a nickel variant, then Matthews is the rush LB.

    In other words, no matter how you slice it, not having Matthews on the line rushing the passer is a waste of about $8 million/year in cap space.
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2014
  15. rodell330
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    It kills me how they try to put such an emphasis on "maximizing" a guys talent after the season is over. Perry should've never been asked to play out in space but you be responsible for rushing the passer...same with Neal. I have the feeling that if TT drafts an olb the scheme may work in our favor...no more experimenting. Its not working.
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  16. Ace
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    So much THIS. I'm tired of moving guys into positions because they might work there, i.e. possibly moving Hyde to safety.
  17. captainWIMM
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    I really hope the Packers come up with some packages in which Perry can rush the passer from the weak side, as he has shown he´s more natural doing it. Not sure it would maximize his ability playing the 7-technique on the strong side.

    If they haven´t done that by now they should have all been fired already!!!
  18. Einstein McFly
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    "Stop trying to maximize talent! Stop moving guys around! It should all work perfectly the first time you try it or YOU'RE FIRED!!!!!111!!!11!!!"

    Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? There are plenty of guys that are much more effective players from certain spots in certain situations than others, and good coaching means finding those combinations.
  19. HardRightEdge
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    My point was Perry with his hand in the dirt is the best look for him. Whether he's at the strong or weak side remains to be seen. All things being equal, anybody should be more affective on the weak side, not getting chipped by the TE. It becomes a question of maximizing Perry and Matthews together, net-net.

    I don't think we can emphasize this enough: the stated purpose here is as a wrinkle alignment, not a scheme change. As I think about this more, as a 4-3 variant it seems like something to address the tweener rush/pass downs.
  20. captainWIMM
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    Absolutely agree with that, seems like I didn´t see you post that in the previous post. My bad.

    Agree with the rest as well.

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