Brees versus Rodgers by the Numbers

PackersRS

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Brees will not win the MVP, if he does there should be an investigation.

He has a better oline than Rodgers, a better defense than Rodgers, and a better run game than Rodgers. Yet his team hasn't won as many games, he doesn't have as many TD passes as Rodgers, he has over twice the interceptions, he plays in a dome.....

Rodgers succeeds and wins in spite of the rest of the team. Protection has been awful, receivers are probably top 3 in the league in passes dropped, defense can' stop anybody. Yet Rodgers can continually hang 30+ on opposing teams without breaking a sweat.

And for the millionth time why should the yards record matter in terms of player value? What is valuable about passing yards? They don't win games. Scoring does and Rodgers is #1 in that category.

Also given the fact that on Sunday, Tom Brady will also break Marino's previously held record, it will mean even less because Brees is not the only player that was able to do it.
Brees doesn't have a better defense than Rodgers.

New Orleans is worse in points per game (21.2 to 21.5), QB rating (78.3 to 86.9), and it's not even close in turnovers, as GB is #1 with 40 forced turnovers (not counting fumbles recovered) and NO is dead last, with 14. NO is ahead in freaking yards allowed, and that's it (it's also ahead in sacks, with 4 more). And even in that category NO is 26th.

NO's defense is basically the GB's defense, but without the turnovers.

People are quick to complain about GB's defense but they don't look at others'...
 

morningwood

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It's a fallacy to say that Drew is never pulled, or that he's padding stats in blowouts.

Drew's last pass against the Giants came with over 12:00 minutes left in the 4th.

Drew's last pass against MN came with over 13:00 left.

Drew did not throw a pass in the 4th against Indy.
 

Jules

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So....who do people think honestly wins it? And please no co-mvp crap.

Brady currently has a shoulder injury. How serious who knows. He will play though. If he has a monster game vs. the stellar Bills defense you might hear what a warrior he was for it.

Now Brees could also easily carve up the pathetic Panthers D assuming he plays the whole game.

Now with Aaron he will have it the toughest of the 3 vs. Suh and his morons and the Lions are an actual playoff team. And Aaron may not even play that long for all we know. I still don't know the Packers are gonna do but with Suh and the gang they may play it safer.

Often voters love the last thing they see. Fair or not.

Can Aaron still hang on and win the MVP if he has say 1 TD or none against the Lions before being pulled and Brady tears up the Bills and Brees the Panthers?
 

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"I think if Coach does decide to limit my playing time, it would be a good opportunity for Matt to get a chance to play and play an extended amount of time," Rodgers said. "He started last year against New England and played excellent. I've said it before, I think he has a bright future in this league as an NFL starter."

A true team QB. He wants Matt to also have a shot to show what he can do. His team is more important then just record chasing or stats.

*wipes tear from eye*
 

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I think Rodgers will win it and I dont think it will be as close as a lot of people think. The efficiency he has had all year is something that's never been seen before. I think the voters will honor that.
 

PackerChamps

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So it looks like on ESPN' sportsnation poll, Brees is edging or tied with Rodgers on who is having a more impressive season. Yes Brees is doing something impressive, by breaking the passing yards record...however much more to a quarterback than that, plus you must look at how he got that many yards.

By the Numbers

Yards:
Brees 5,087 yards over Rodgers 4,643 yards (Brees has 9.56% more yards than Rodgers)

Completions:
Brees 440 completions over Rodgers 343 completions (Brees has 28.7% more completions than Rodgers)

Completion %:
Brees 70.7% over Rodgers 68.3% (%'s speak for themselves)

Yards Per attempt:
Rodgers 9.25 yards per attempt over Brees 8.18 yards per attempt (Rodgers has 13.1% more yards per attempt than Brees)

Interceptions:
Brees 13 interceptions over Rodgers 6 interceptions (Brees has 116.7% more interceptions than Rodgers)

Touchdowns:
Rodgers 45 touchdowns over Brees 41 touchdowns (Rodgers has 9.75% more touchdowns than Brees)

Touchdown to Interception Ratio
Rodgers 7.5:1 over Brees 3.15:1 (ratios..speak for themselves, Rodgers ratio is nearly two and half times better)

Interception % (Interceptions/Attempts)
Brees 2.95% over Rodgers 1.75% (%'s speak for themselves)

Passer Rating:
Rodgers 122.5 rating over Brees 108.4 (Rodgers has a 13% greater rating...if you want to calculate it that way...)

Rushing Yards:
Rodgers 257 yards over Brees 81 yards (Rodgers has 217% more rushing yards than Brees)

Rushing Yards per attempt:
Rodgers 4.3 yards per attempt over Brees 4.1 yards per attempt (Rogers has 4.9% more rushing yards per attempt than Brees)

Rushing Touchdowns:
Rodgers 3 touchdowns over Brees 1 touchdown (3 times as many TD's for Rodgers)

Total Touchdowns:
Rodgers 48 touchdowns over Brees 42 touchdowns (14.3% more touchdowns for Rodgers than Brees)

Wins:
Rodgers 14 wins over Brees 12 wins

Head to head:

Rodgers 1-0 versus Brees 0-1



The only category Brees dominates in completions over Rodgers and has the advantage is passing yards and completion rate. However, Rodgers averages more yards per attempt, negating a lot of Brees' advantage in that category (granted he did break the record...). However, Rodgers dominates in TD to INT ratio, passer rating, yards per passing attempt, (the lack of) interceptions and total touchdowns. Rodgers has the advantage in wins, passing touchdowns, rushing touchdowns, yards per rushing attempt, and has the head to head win. Rodgers will likely break the passer rating record as well.

The reason I would favor even Brady over Brees if Rodgers is taken out of the equation is where they play.

Brees plays in a climate controlled environment which I feel accounts for 800 - 1000 of his yards.

I say this by looking at his stats SD vs NO. below. His yardarge jumped 800 his first year there and has pretty much stayed at that increased level. If you put Rodgers or Brady in a dome, I would expect their yardage and completions to go up significantly.
SEASON TEAM
GP​
CMP​
ATT​
CMP%​
YDS​
AVG​
TD​
LNG​
INT​
FUM​
RAT​
2001
1​
15​
27​
55.6​
221​
8.19​
1​
40​
0​
2​
94.8​
2002
16​
320​
526​
60.8​
3,284​
6.24​
17​
52​
16​
2​
76.9​
2003
11​
205​
356​
57.6​
2,108​
5.92​
11​
68​
15​
4​
67.5​
2004
15​
262​
400​
65.5​
3,159​
7.90​
27​
79​
7​
4​
104.8​
2005
16​
323​
500​
64.6​
3,576​
7.15​
24​
54​
15​
8​
89.2​
2006
16​
356​
554​
64.3​
4,418​
7.98​
26​
86​
11​
5​
96.2​
2007
16​
440​
652​
67.5​
4,423​
6.78​
28​
58​
18​
8​
89.4​
2008
16​
413​
635​
65.0​
5,069​
7.98​
34​
84​
17​
1​
96.2​
2009
15​
363​
514​
70.6​
4,388​
8.54​
34​
75​
11​
9​
109.6​
2010
16​
448​
658​
68.1​
4,620​
7.02​
33​
80​
22​
9​
90.9​
2011
15​
440​
622​
70.7​
5,087​
8.18​
41​
79​
13​
0​
108.4​
 

Ceodore

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^ Something happened to your post.

I have a bad feeling Brees is going to win even though I dont think he should.
 

morningwood

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I would think that Drew's numbers went up in NOLA for reasons other than the stadium. You are necessarily putting a lot of emphasis on the turf since San Diego's weather is near perfect at any given moment of the year.
 

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http://www.patriotledger.com/mobile...ive-Brady-the-credit-but-give-Rodgers-the-MVP

FOXBORO —New Orleans quarterback Drew Brees has thrown for an NFL-record 5,087 yards – and he still has another 300 yards in his future (at home versus Carolina on Sunday).

New England quarterback Tom Brady has hoisted a team handicapped by the league’s worst defense up on his shoulders and carried it to an AFC-leading 12 wins in 15 games – including a seven-game winning streak heading into Sunday’s regular-season finale with Buffalo at Gillette Stadium.

And the 2011 league MVP award should go to neither one of them.

The 2011 league MVP trophy belongs in Mr. Rodgers’ neighborhood.

With last Sunday night’s career-high five-touchdown performance against the Chicago Bears behind a makeshift line (Brady knows that feeling), Aaron Rodgers helped the Packers secure the top seed in the NFC playoffs, making his game with the Detroit Lions in Green Bay as significant as their preseason opener with Cleveland back on Aug. 13.

In another “Brett Who?” campaign, Rodgers has set single-season records for a legendary franchise with 4,643 yards passing and 45 touchdowns while throwing just six interceptions.

Posting 13 games with a quarterback rating of 100-plus along the way, Rodgers boasts an overall rating of 122.5 that exceeds Peyton Manning’s league-record 121.1 with Indianapolis in 2004.

Rodgers brings an added element to his game, adding 257 yards rushing, 4.3 per carry, with three TDs.

All of this while burdened by a defense that isn’t dead last in the NFL only because the Patriots are in the league.

If Rodgers’ passing numbers – most notably TDs to interceptions – look familiar, they should.
During his first of two MVP campaigns, that magical 2007 regular season, Brady threw for 4,806 yards and 50 TDs with eight interceptions, compiling a passer rating of 117.2 in a year in which the Patriots’ offense made the scoreboard look like a pinball machine.

Now, Brees’ supporters will point to the fact that he broke a 27-year-old league record that was held by a Hall of Fame quarterback (Miami’s Dan Marino).

As anyone who watched him perform in the Saints’ 45-16 romp over Atlanta in New Orleans on Monday night can attest, Brees is making it look easy in “The Big Easy.”

Brady’s supporters will point to the fact that he hasn’t broken under the pressure of having to constantly put up points to overcome a defense that cannot prevent them while running an offense whose running game is modest at best (ranked 19th in the league).

As anyone who’s seen the Patriots play for any length of time this season can attest, Brady (whose career-high 4,897 yards exceeds Rodgers’ 4,643 and have him within shouting distance of Brees) is bringing hope to a team that is utterly defenseless.

With their teams still playing for playoff-seeding purposes, Brees and Brady will no doubt improve their numbers this Sunday; in Rodgers’ case, what you see may very well be what you’ve got.

Still, Rodgers’ 45-to-6 TD-to-interception ratio – a ratio that blows awa Brees’ 41-to-13 and Brady’s 36-to-11; heck, it’s even better than Brady’s 50-to-8 in 2007 – for a team that will lead the NFL in regular-season wins with either 14 or 15 cannot be overlooked.

In any other year, a season like Brees’ and Brady’s would be cause for them to be dusting off their mantels; not this year.

Give Brees the record, give Brady credit, but give Rodgers the MVP.
 

GreenBlood

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He has a better oline than Rodgers, a better defense than Rodgers...

Okay, I really want to know. Where do people get this asinine idea that the Saints defense is better than ours? We give up less than 30 yards more per game. We have allowed fewer points. We have more than twice as many turnovers and about 30 more passes defended. They have 5 or 6 more sacks.

Anyone who thinks their defense is better than ours is simply not paying attention.
 

GreenBlood

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I think Brees wins it easily on the percentage completion, but one thing no one is going to mention is that Rodgers don't really have much of a running game...

So Brees should win because he has completed about 3% more of his passes??? Even though Rodgers completely out-performs him in every single other efficiency statistic (td/int ratio, td/attemps, int/attempts, qb rating)? You think 3% is all that matters? REALLY? I sure hope you're being facetious, otherwise that's one of the dumbest things I've ever read.

BTW, our run game is just fine. We simply don't use it that much.
 

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So Brees should win because he has completed about 3% more of his passes??? Even though Rodgers completely out-performs him in every single other efficiency statistic (td/int ratio, td/attemps, int/attempts, qb rating)? You think 3% is all that matters? REALLY? I sure hope you're being facetious, otherwise that's one of the dumbest things I've ever read.

BTW, our run game is just fine. We simply don't use it that much.

After last week it's down to about a 2% difference in completion %. Brees is at 70.7 and Rodgers at 68.3. But really and honestly Packer fans, if they give the MVP to Brees there's no reason to raise hell. Yes Rodgers probably deserves it more but Brees also deserves it. It may be a situation like Raji. How did Raji make the pro bowl? It was sort of a lifetime award thing. Brees should have won the MVP before but got snubbed. They may give it to him this time partly for that reason. I'm not saying that it's totally for non-football reasons that they give Brees the MVP, but that the non-football reasons may tip the scales in his direction because he has had such a great season.

And regarding the Saints defense, they have shown improvement mainly against the run. They are defending the run much better than the Packers atm, so yes, there is a case for the Saints playing better defense right now. Passing defense is another story. Saints suck on pass defense as much as we do.

Bogart: I'm not sure I agree with you that Rodgers has thrown more TD's than Brees because the Saints run it in more. Rodgers has 3 rushing TDs. Brees has 1. Brees actually gets more chances than Rodgers, you can't ignore that when you start making claims like that.
 

morningwood

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I am actually very pleased with the way our defense is playing. I would love to see more pressure from our front 4, but even that has improved. We certainly need more turnovers.

The old adage "the numbers don't lie" doesn't always apply to football. The situation can lead to some skewed numbers -- and of course that applies to the Pack as well. Our secondary is a lot better than one might think just looking at numbers.
 

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Not sure where I see the improvement on the pass rush. McCown wasn't pressured at all. Neither was Orton. Orton had all day. Both Chicago and KC ran the ball very well and used play-action off of that with very good results.
 

Greenbayphil

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I think the problem is whilst rodgers was playing his best football from weeks 1-11 roughly, he was playing at a level no other QB was palying at, since the Giants game he has taken a slight dip in his productivity whilst Brees has maintained the same level of play all year round.

Its just when they were both playing at a high level, Rodgers was playing at a level brees couldnt keep up with, thats why half way through the season Rodgers would have been and was the unanimous MVP.

I still think both of them deserve to get the MVP but as far as Im concerned Rodgers has had a better year.

Main reason?

He has thrown for more TD's and less INT's
 

Vladimirr

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Brees is a great player, worthy of a lot of respect.

However Rodgers is 14-1 (Engineered a 19-game winning streak) and leads passer rating by a mile (looking to break the season record). Even in that new QBR that faults a QB for not falling behind in score, he's the season leader. Not sure how you could argue that a player is more valuable to their team this year.
 

Ceodore

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I have a bad feeling Brees is going to win even though I dont think he should.

This is what I'm talking about.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...saints-record-breaking-offense-seals-the-deal

With that, by the slimmest of margins, Drew Brees is the 2011 NFL MVP.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7383377/overlook-brees-nfl-mvp

As it stands, Rodgers probably will win the league's most prestigious individual award anyway. He has had a fantastic season. It is his award to lose.
But Drew Brees is equally deserving. If New Orleans wins its last two regular-season games, against Atlanta and Carolina, and -- as expected -- Brees obliterates Dan Marino's 27-year-old record for passing yards in a season, I will be hard-pressed to vote for Rodgers over Brees.

And these are from people who probably have votes.
 

longtimefan

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Dont think the bleacher reporter has a vote, by the"reporters" name, he is a Lions fan

Like Brees, Rodgers has been outstanding, and he probably will be most voters' selection for MVP. The Packers are 13-1, and Rodgers has thrown 40 touchdown passes and just six interceptions and is on the brink of setting an NFL record for passer rating in a season. Rodgers has been efficient, accurate, relentless and consistently good. One bad game against the Chiefs doesn't change that.

So how is it a non voter from Bleacher and a ESPN reporter that says Rodgers will win translates to Brees will win it?
 

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I'm not saying that it's totally for non-football reasons that they give Brees the MVP, but that the non-football reasons may tip the scales in his direction.

What non-football reasons?

Saints suck on pass defense as much as we do.

Our pass defense is much better than theirs. We only give up 7 more yards per game than they do. But we also have 21 more interceptions than they do and we've defensed about 25 more passes than they have.

Bogart: I'm not sure I agree with you that Rodgers has thrown more TD's than Brees because the Saints run it in more. Rodgers has 3 rushing TDs. Brees has 1. Brees actually gets more chances than Rodgers, you can't ignore that when you start making claims like that.

They have run the ball 25 more times than we have, or 1.67 more rushes per game, or 0.41 more rushes per quarter (in other words, not enough to make a difference).

Brees has thrown the ball 97 more times than Rodgers (mostly because his coaching staff wanted him to get Marino's record and they NEVER pulled him from a game). If you extrapolate Rodgers stats to match the attempts Brees has had, which is something most MVP voters do when comparing two players, Rodgers blows him out of the water. And yes, it is completely valid to do so because number of attempts is not something players generally have much control over.
 

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I would think that Drew's numbers went up in NOLA for reasons other than the stadium. You are necessarily putting a lot of emphasis on the turf since San Diego's weather is near perfect at any given moment of the year.

Of course, San Diego and NO have exactly the same field. Neither have any wind and it never rains on either field :confused:.

Last time I checked, Philip Rivers took that Brees team through quite a few playoff trips so I don't think it was loaded with rejects. The first year Brees arrived at NO he went over 4000 yards and never below it. He never topped 4000 in his years at SD. Also, except for 1, his complete pct has been higher in each year than any at SD.

I like Brees and he is good, but he doesn't deserve it over Rodgers this year or even over Brady for that matter.
 

Ceodore

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Dont think the bleacher reporter has a vote, by the"reporters" name, he is a Lions fan

So how is it a non voter from Bleacher and a ESPN reporter that says Rodgers will win translates to Brees will win it?

Both say AR will probably win but both think Brees should. And the voter more or less said she would be voting for Brees.

There are going to be a lot of voters with the mentality of, I'm afraid, that "AR had the better year but Brees broke the record and he's a pretty stand up guy, so we should give it to him anyway." I can see enough people saying "well AR will win, but i kindof think Brees deserves it too so i'll just vote for him." Then all of the sudden AR loses.
 

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